Donald Trump is the president-elect of the U.S. • Hacker News Board

Re: Donald Trump is the president-elect of the U.S.

#221

Post by WillPostForFood » Wed, Nov 09, 2016, 8:16 AM UTC

Mikeb85 wrote: post #186

thewarrior wrote: post #44

It is possible to view this as an isolated event or a trend. Coming on the heels of BREXIT this is a trend. The attempts at building an interconnected globalised world are beginning to fail. A bunch of elites decided to create their own trans-national utopia unchecked by borders and dismissed all criticism as racist or bigoted. The globalisation project has been rejected by a majority of the population. Whether it is…

You can't sacrifice large swaths of the population for the so called "greater" good. Globalisation, as it stands now, is neo-colonialism. It offshores blue collar jobs and concentrates white collar jobs in rich countries. It disenfranchises blue collar workers in the west, and causes brain drain in the developing world. All it's done is benefit the elite. Read progressive economists like Piketty, and combine it with…

Software development and IT jobs that moved to India and China are blue collar? Call centers?

Re: Donald Trump is the president-elect of the U.S.

#222

Post by gscott » Wed, Nov 09, 2016, 8:16 AM UTC

nostrademons wrote: post #66

sho_hn wrote: post #14

So as a European ... Clinton didn't spend enough time in the Upper Midwest expecting to carry those states, but Trump had an actual message for them (NAFTA, etc.) while Hillary didn't, and they don't care that he is racist and sexist, they want their jobs back, so the election was called by a 40+ white demo in an economically depressed region just like old Middle England called Brexit. About right?

TBH I don't think there was anything Clinton could've done to alter this election result, other than not being female and (possibly) not getting involved in so many scandals beforehand. This was a widespread popular-vote miss: Clinton lost across a large number of states (PA, WI, MI, FL, NC) that she had polled ahead in, and even in ones she carried (like NH, ME, or MN) the margin of victory was much less than expect…

She could have won it if her platform offered hope and excitement for the future of a regular person.

She offered free college education... that doesn't work very well if you quit high school to work in a factory or if you are like me and horrible at math (I can do everything else but that).

Job retraining doesn't work very well because many people train for the same thing. One great NPR story had a person who retrained in HVAC but he said that around 100 other people in the plant trained for the same thing unless if people move they need some sort of manual labor job.

People who worked in a factory are unlikely to start building websites, apps, manage databases, go into business management etc... they need another factory job or a basic income.

Re: Donald Trump is the president-elect of the U.S.

#223

Post by StavrosK » Wed, Nov 09, 2016, 8:17 AM UTC

spaceman_2020 wrote: post #103

thewarrior wrote: post #44

It is possible to view this as an isolated event or a trend. Coming on the heels of BREXIT this is a trend. The attempts at building an interconnected globalised world are beginning to fail. A bunch of elites decided to create their own trans-national utopia unchecked by borders and dismissed all criticism as racist or bigoted. The globalisation project has been rejected by a majority of the population. Whether it is…

As a brown Indian dude, it seems to me that the western world is caught in some self-hating loop. It simultaneously trivializes my culture while hating its own culture. I watched Justin Trudeau dance the bhangra and people claim "oh what beautiful Indian culture". I've seen people eat butter chicken to partake in "Indian culture" experiences. That's just wrong. Indian culture - any culture - is far, far more than a d…

Yo, americans aren't the only "white people".

Re: Donald Trump is the president-elect of the U.S.

#224

Post by vidoc » Wed, Nov 09, 2016, 8:17 AM UTC

thewarrior wrote: post #44

It is possible to view this as an isolated event or a trend. Coming on the heels of BREXIT this is a trend. The attempts at building an interconnected globalised world are beginning to fail. A bunch of elites decided to create their own trans-national utopia unchecked by borders and dismissed all criticism as racist or bigoted. The globalisation project has been rejected by a majority of the population. Whether it is…

You say it very well.

And much like brexit, this fiasco reveals how much of a fool the journalistic establishment has made of itself. At least we can stop debating one thing at this point, whether or not the media is somehow disconnected with reality.

Re: Donald Trump is the president-elect of the U.S.

#225

Post by gotofritz » Wed, Nov 09, 2016, 8:17 AM UTC

thewarrior wrote: post #44

It is possible to view this as an isolated event or a trend. Coming on the heels of BREXIT this is a trend. The attempts at building an interconnected globalised world are beginning to fail. A bunch of elites decided to create their own trans-national utopia unchecked by borders and dismissed all criticism as racist or bigoted. The globalisation project has been rejected by a majority of the population. Whether it is…

Or, more simply, Clinton was the wrong candidate.

Re: Donald Trump is the president-elect of the U.S.

#226

Post by Nadya » Wed, Nov 09, 2016, 8:17 AM UTC

Surprisingly, namecalling doesn't sway votes. Calling people with genuine concerns about their country and well-being racist and sexist doesn't win you votes. Calling half the country Deplorable doesn't win you votes.

It doesn't help that the DNC rigged the election against Bernie, Clinton isn't "relatable" and struggles with public image, Clinton was under FBI investigation, both Clintons have had years and years of scandals. I'm honestly surprised it was even as close as it was for the popular vote.

I did not vote, but it should be fairly obvious from this post or my post history that I lean pro-Trump and very strongly against Clinton. For those who disagree with it, I'm sure the first response is blaming bigots and racists and sexists and blah blah blah. Rather than listening to half of your country - you shout over them and call them names, names which are only sometimes "earned".

The country can either grow more divided or we can grow together. The next four years will determine which direction we head.

Re: Donald Trump is the president-elect of the U.S.

#227

Post by prawn » Wed, Nov 09, 2016, 8:17 AM UTC

jrockway wrote: post #88

thewarrior wrote: post #44

It is possible to view this as an isolated event or a trend. Coming on the heels of BREXIT this is a trend. The attempts at building an interconnected globalised world are beginning to fail. A bunch of elites decided to create their own trans-national utopia unchecked by borders and dismissed all criticism as racist or bigoted. The globalisation project has been rejected by a majority of the population. Whether it is…

Globalization isn't the problem. Computerization is. Other countries are not taking "our" jobs. We simply don't need those jobs anymore. Taxes on foreign labor will only do one thing: subsidize robots. We're going to spend billions of dollars on a big wall, and I guarantee you we're not going to have a lot more jobs after that. (The wall itself is a pretty big project though.)

Disagree that computerisation is this problem. It's a problem, but it's not what's driven this. Why would the vote fall so strongly down racial lines if the primary problem was the elimination of lower-end jobs?

(Along with one of your respondents, I also don't think the wall or many other promises will eventuate.)

Re: Donald Trump is the president-elect of the U.S.

#228

Post by hackaflocka » Wed, Nov 09, 2016, 8:17 AM UTC

Between all-purpose generic islamic terrorism (from Thailand to Phillipines to India to Middle-East to Paris to Belgium to London to USA), and black lives matter terrorism, the US needs a reboot.

This is that reboot.

Another brown indian dude here. I love western culture and society. I love the innovation, the science and the secularism. I'm sick of the left trying to convert it into a faux third world.

For example: I teach at a university. This semester, there's a woman walking around campus in a burka. In the freaking US of A, a woman is walking around with a burka. WTF is wrong with these people?

Re: Donald Trump is the president-elect of the U.S.

#229

Post by codeonfire » Wed, Nov 09, 2016, 8:17 AM UTC

vatotemking wrote: post #173

acjohnson55 wrote: post #52

This is utter madness. If we're lucky, this wheels fall off this whole enterprise and these people are discredited before they do too much harm. It's deeply frustrating to hear so much crap analysis of what's been going on. If we're really honest with ourselves about what's happening, we're seeing a massive vote for protectionism of a particular demographics that have long enjoyed it. People talk a lot about the forg…

> In that way, he's managed to get an extremely energetic white vote. Does this mean the majority of Americans are secretly inherently racist? Note: I am not from the US and this a genuine question and no offense meant.

Of course they fucking are. Why pretend at this point. All pretense is gone.

Re: Donald Trump is the president-elect of the U.S.

#230

Post by RandomInteger4 » Wed, Nov 09, 2016, 8:18 AM UTC

spaceman_2020 wrote: post #103

thewarrior wrote: post #44

It is possible to view this as an isolated event or a trend. Coming on the heels of BREXIT this is a trend. The attempts at building an interconnected globalised world are beginning to fail. A bunch of elites decided to create their own trans-national utopia unchecked by borders and dismissed all criticism as racist or bigoted. The globalisation project has been rejected by a majority of the population. Whether it is…

As a brown Indian dude, it seems to me that the western world is caught in some self-hating loop. It simultaneously trivializes my culture while hating its own culture. I watched Justin Trudeau dance the bhangra and people claim "oh what beautiful Indian culture". I've seen people eat butter chicken to partake in "Indian culture" experiences. That's just wrong. Indian culture - any culture - is far, far more than a d…

You do realize that what the great renaissance intellectuals created, the right wing in the united stated looks down upon and scoffs at, right? They hate anything to do with art or culture unless it's their version of Christianity.

This is the same attitude of Boko Haram.

The left wing doesn't dismiss the great cultural achievements the west has created, but we try to create space for them within a nation known for accepting immigrants, rather than forcefully imposing our culture on them, which seems to have failed so brilliantly in places like France.

The politicians trivialize this shit, because they pander to the voters. The left embraces other cultures because we're sick of getting Christianity shoved down our throats.