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Dalai Lama: Behind Our Anxiety, the Fear of Being Unneeded

nytimes.com

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Re: Dalai Lama: Behind Our Anxiety, the Fear of Being Unneeded

#261

Post by warlox »

wefarrell wrote: post #35
sjclemmy wrote: post #16

It's odd, the world is the safest and most stable that it has ever been. There has never been a better time to be a human being, and yet, the media and certain politicians would have you believe that there is disaster after disaster, terrorist plots afoot around every corner, feeding your fear day after day. If ever there was an example of the devil at work, then that's it(and I'm not even religious). Uncertainty abo…

If you're referring to safety from physical harm you're correct. But I'd argue that the erosion of many social safety nets has left a lot of people less economically secure.

Read a Dickens novel and tell me about how great the social safety nets in Victorian England were.

Re: Dalai Lama: Behind Our Anxiety, the Fear of Being Unneeded

#262

Post by warlox »

18972345 wrote: post #225
sjclemmy wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's better in every way. Racism, sexism, apartheid, LGBT, corporal punishment...

If you genuinely think these are the best markers for improvement in society, you must be an extremely lucky person. Having a job, having a job that doesn't completely suck, having enough money to move out of your parents house at the age of 30. These are things that people are facing today. In Australia, there are lots of people that are still living with their parents into their 30s because they simply can't afford…

You are obviously a white male. You have no credibility when it comes to denying discrimination. You have never been in danger of being fired or lynched for some intrinsic characteristic.

Re: Dalai Lama: Behind Our Anxiety, the Fear of Being Unneeded

#263

Post by scythe »

jacobolus wrote: post #214
scythe wrote: post #198

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's nice, but it suffers from a few defects: - apparently I've committed the sin of having sympathy for the other side, so I must agree with them - if it's rhetoric then it's also independent invention because I certainly didn't get it anywhere and never meant to imply it; I only expressed a certain possible flaw in a purportedly logical argument, and there are others (eg that higher housing prices specifically ca…

I think you’re taking my comment rather more personally than is reasonable. I don’t have any idea what you believe, who you sympathize with, etc. You said “Cohesion of the whole can be impaired despite all the parts being of good quality, if they do not fit together very well.” This sort of vague analogy has been a common rhetorical device used by anti-immigrant populists trying to stir up nativist resentment for 150…

>This sort of vague analogy has been a common rhetorical device used by anti-immigrant populists trying to stir up nativist resentment for 150+ years, without any strong evidence that it’s true. I’m calling the specific sentence out for being usually, in my opinion, toxic nonsense.

Toxic nonsense is what happens when people misuse the idea of scientific proof to lend credence to their political beliefs. Again, I'm not talking to the kind of people who are swayed by that kind of thing. I'm discussing a flaw in the structure of your argument you refuse to acknowledge.

Look, nobody believes "scientific proof" in relation to the things where it's really important (global warming, vaccination) anymore because it's been dragged through the mud by people who want to wave the banner of science in defense of some cause which they think is noble but where the quality of evidence just isn't as strong. That's what I'm concerned about. This is Hacker News, there's nobody for me to scare here.

And, deny it or not, you're being personal, and selective in your responses, which makes me feel this has been a rather unproductive conversation.

Re: Dalai Lama: Behind Our Anxiety, the Fear of Being Unneeded

#264

Post by scythe »

warlox wrote: post #260
scythe wrote: post #172

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Germany, Ireland, Italy, Poland, etc weren't drastically more corrupt than the United States a hundred years ago, were they? Also, "there were not problems" is questionable; this prior flow of migration may have contributed to the infamously low value of labor during the Gilded age. > immigrants [...] commit less (or at least not more) crime For the record I'm agnostic on this issue, but it bothers me that a lot of v…

Tell me more about Polish government corruption in 1916. I'd be interested in what you have to say about it.

Ha ha, it didn't exist. There's only one significant figure, smart guy.

Re: Dalai Lama: Behind Our Anxiety, the Fear of Being Unneeded

#265

Post by reddytowns »

makomk wrote: post #258
reddytowns wrote: post #169

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Legitimate court systems, accountable political system, protection of labor rights, they are all examples of things not being corrupt. So the reason for less corruption can't be less corruption. You're talking in circles here.

If you don't have a legitimate court system or an accountable political system it's very hard to fight corruption, which makes it rather unlikely that either of those things will be established. So the reason for less corruption now can indeed be less corruption in the past.

So if less corruption in the past is the reason there is less corruption now, how does society ever get corrupt?

Re: Dalai Lama: Behind Our Anxiety, the Fear of Being Unneeded

#266

Post by lifeisstillgood »

18972345 wrote: post #226
lifeisstillgood wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But it is terribly, terribly good for the middle class. Penicillin, socialised medicine, low violent crime rates (#), no need to hunt our food, no need to build our own shelters or rub sticks together to make fire. The finest actors of this and past generations wait for me in my living room while I pee, something that past kings could not even achieve, I travel vast continents in the time it takes for a long sleep, I…

No need to hunt for food isn't even a good thing. We are designed to hunt. We actually like doing it. Now, people don't get enough exercise or the right type of exercise and so after our 9 hours of work, we have to go to the gym and simulate physical work. Most people also hate their jobs because we were not designed to sit on a computer all day.

No need is a good thing. Ignoring our evolutionary heritage in our daily lives a bad thing

Anyway, any hunter from ten thousand years ago would laugh at the energy I expend in the gym. Hunters expend intelligence in order not to expend energy

Re: Dalai Lama: Behind Our Anxiety, the Fear of Being Unneeded

#267

Post by warlox »

scythe wrote: post #264
warlox wrote: post #260

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tell me more about Polish government corruption in 1916. I'd be interested in what you have to say about it.

Ha ha, it didn't exist. There's only one significant figure, smart guy.

It also happens that the Irish (local) and Italian governments were a lot more corrupt than America was in 1916. Italy is much more corrupt than America to this day. You're clearly a crackpot who doesn't know what he's talking about.

Re: Dalai Lama: Behind Our Anxiety, the Fear of Being Unneeded

#268

Post by Frondo »

ThrustVectoring wrote: post #253
Frondo wrote: post #252

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's the point of dog-whistle politics. That's exactly it. If you're not already part of the subculture primed to pick up on these cues--if you don't hear the dog whistle--you don't get what the speaker/writer is saying. The famous Lee Atwater quote is a good example of this ( https://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Lee_Atwater ). It's plausible deniability for espousing racist views in public.

Yeah no, I'm not that complicated of a person. When I say that my community has better culture, it's because I like the cultural factors we have. People here don't care if I'm openly bisexual, whereas Uganda has lynch mobs that will set you on fire. Or how I can easily speak the truth as I see it on religious matters here, but get sentenced to torture for atheistic twitter messages in Saudi Arabia. If having these pr…

Sure, you get the freedom to say and think whatever you want, about whoever you want. So do I.

So go ahead, by all means, have whatever views you want. Espouse whatever views you want.

I don't really care, because I don't know you and will never, ever need to work with you, do business with you, invite you to my wedding or holiday dinner, whatever.

All that said, dog whistle politics is a real thing, even if you or other people here don't know about it. And not knowing about the specific cues just means you're not part of the group that'll respond to that dog whistle.

Re: Dalai Lama: Behind Our Anxiety, the Fear of Being Unneeded

#269

Post by scythe »

warlox wrote: post #267
scythe wrote: post #264

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ha ha, it didn't exist. There's only one significant figure, smart guy.

It also happens that the Irish (local) and Italian governments were a lot more corrupt than America was in 1916. Italy is much more corrupt than America to this day. You're clearly a crackpot who doesn't know what he's talking about.

>the Irish and Italian governments were a lot more corrupt

You're going to have to provide some numbers. I don't think that you understand what's going on here.

Although, I should point out that you have no objection to discussing the Irish government in 1916. If I want to argue like you, I could try to say that proves you're a moron, but maybe it's okay to be a little less than computer-level specificity while discussing the general governance of those areas. The Austro-Hungarian Empire and the British Empire were among the world's largest economies. Italy was the first country to use airplanes in warfare.

I didn't want to get into this side of the argument because it's unsavory and frankly insulting to even consider but the point is that acknowledgment of doubt is necessary for intellectual honesty in any issue this complex. The existence of certainty among people hoping for "open borders" is likely a result of wishful thinking.

>You're clearly a crackpot who doesn't know what he's talking about.

No, I'm explaining flaws in an argument which is touted as airtight and used by a lot of arrogant bullies such as yourself to shut down dissent on a controversial issue, and you're trolling. You have contributed nothing but insults because you don't have a real argument; you just try to catch mistakes (but you didn't catch any) and call people dumb.

So you're the crackpot, and get bent.

Re: Dalai Lama: Behind Our Anxiety, the Fear of Being Unneeded

#270

Post by orasis »

white-flame wrote: post #221
orasis wrote: post #93

This is the big missing piece with basic income: People need meaning in their lives as much as they need money.

Meaning has next to nothing to do with income and sustenance. Problems with those can easily distract you from the very concept of stepping back and looking at meaning to your life. Excess of those can be their own burden as well. Some sort of basic income really doesn't change much at all, besides helping to remove distractions from the destitute to be freer to pursuing meaning.

For most people, meaning has a lot to do with value creation. Corporations are institutions for value creation. If most people were equipped to create value on their own we'd see a lot more entrepreneurs.

Don't get me wrong, I think we'll need BI, but it won't be enough.

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