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Safer to Puff, E-Cigarettes Can’t Shake Their Reputation as a Menace

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Re: Safer to Puff, E-Cigarettes Can’t Shake Their Reputation as a Menace

#121

Post by duaneb »

Shivetya wrote: post #18
jrockway wrote: post #2

The reality is that tobacco taxes fund a lot of the government, and there is no replacement for that income source if people stop smoking cigarettes. Thus the tobacco companies are happy to lobby against e-cigarettes to protect their revenue stream and the government is happy to support them because it's their revenue stream too. It's unfortunate, because it's largely a tax on the poor. The rich can afford prescripti…

The tobacco companies are adept at adapting to the market. I would suspect they all either have e-cig products out or are in the process of doing so. As far as taxes, the US has one of the most progressive tax schemes in the world and income is not a major wealth point for many Americans (though it does beget a ton of jealousy) Not to go too far off track. The real tax on the poor isn't cigarettes, for the poor and s…

Of course they have e-cig brands; they're the disgusting gas station brands that will be the only viable business in the market in two years. It now costs $1 Million to approve a new flavor at every nicotine concentration: the tobacco companies couldn't have asked for anything better: it's like they're functionally illegal, but they also make more money.

There are other measures like the $2 "tobacco" tax on ballot in California now that means you'll pay $3 for a coil worth $1. This was also likely lobbied by the tobacco companies.

Finally, realize that theres nothing expensive about making these eliquids. Somehow they pulled an arbitrary way of making it more expensive than any other way of leaving tobacco out of their ass.

Re: Safer to Puff, E-Cigarettes Can’t Shake Their Reputation as a Menace

#122

Post by duaneb »

imgabe wrote: post #101

Of course it's great if you're replacing normal cigarettes with it. But why should we pretend it's healthy to do if you weren't smoking to begin with? Nicotine is still highly addictive and causes heart disease. If you're not currently using nicotine, why start?

Obviously don't start. But do write the FDA urging them to recognize them as at least less unhealthy than cigarettes. And removing those moronic testing charges associated with flavor and nicotine would help consumers make healthy choices instead of accepting the tobacco companies products and actually get people off of smoking.

Re: Safer to Puff, E-Cigarettes Can’t Shake Their Reputation as a Menace

#123

Post by agumonkey »

spdustin wrote: post #119
agumonkey wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I bought one for my mother because her health seemed lowering. She didn't like it and didn't want to spend time searching for the right device and/or liquid. She had an infarctus (not myocard it seems though) last month, obviously cardio told her no more cigarettes. She was worried about nicotine addiction, I mentioned e-cig, I got angry eyes, borderline saying it was worth than cigs. I understand their concerns abou…

My guess: You got angry eyes because nicotine is a stimulant and (speaking from experience) can cause heart rate abnormalities.

Sure, but they give nicotine gums so it doesn't matter. I was just thinking about a smooth transition toward healthy lifestyle. (no cigs, no ecigs, no gums).

Re: Safer to Puff, E-Cigarettes Can’t Shake Their Reputation as a Menace

#124

Post by teilo »

lightedman wrote: post #97

As long as people keep playing the sub-ohm game, thus keeping the majority of heat dissipation in the battery (I've seen 5 milli-Ohm coils, imagine where the heat's going when an 18650 has a typical resistance of 100 milli-ohms fresh) then yes, these things will be a menace. Just the other day a sub-ohmer at the mental health facility I was re-wiring had his battery explode on him. POPFIZZLE! It was just sitting on t…

This is indeed a problem if people are using mechanical mods. But with a sufficient battery pack and proper voltage/current regulation, and batteries from reputable manufacturers (Sony, Samsung, LG, etc.), it's not even a concern.

Also, the mechanical mod crowd is a rather small part of the e-cig community overall. Vocal, but small.

Re: Safer to Puff, E-Cigarettes Can’t Shake Their Reputation as a Menace

#125

Post by KirinDave »

alexdumitru wrote: post #116
lightedman wrote: post #97

As long as people keep playing the sub-ohm game, thus keeping the majority of heat dissipation in the battery (I've seen 5 milli-Ohm coils, imagine where the heat's going when an 18650 has a typical resistance of 100 milli-ohms fresh) then yes, these things will be a menace. Just the other day a sub-ohmer at the mental health facility I was re-wiring had his battery explode on him. POPFIZZLE! It was just sitting on t…

You scared me a bit, as I'm using 0.25 ohm. Can you explain what's the problem or provide some resources to read? I was pretty scared of ecigs before, seeing so many exploding.

Okay, so... Extremely simplified (slightly incorrect) but good rule of thumb for you at the end.

What happens when you hotwire a battery (a wire between positive and negative)? Current flows, discharging the battery but also often melting or exploding the battery. Normally current flow is the whole reason for a battery, but why is hotwiring bad as opposed to tossing a LED+resistor in the circuit?

In a circuit, heat accumulates where majority of resistance is. So when your element has less resistance than your battery, more of the stress is going there than on your heating element. So it's hard on your power supply. If it's a cool 5v hobbyist power supply, you're probably cool. They're durable. Don't stress too much, you're more likely to break the element. But if it's a battery, you're sinking heat into something that is ultimately full of volatile chemicals and has limited capacity to fight back.

You can engineer circuits around this problem in a variety of ways, but the cavemun solution is just to give the battery time to discharge the heat by transferring the charge to an intermediate element (obviously your ecig rig hasn't popped yet).

Re: Safer to Puff, E-Cigarettes Can’t Shake Their Reputation as a Menace

#126

Post by [deleted] »

alexdumitru wrote: post #116
lightedman wrote: post #97

As long as people keep playing the sub-ohm game, thus keeping the majority of heat dissipation in the battery (I've seen 5 milli-Ohm coils, imagine where the heat's going when an 18650 has a typical resistance of 100 milli-ohms fresh) then yes, these things will be a menace. Just the other day a sub-ohmer at the mental health facility I was re-wiring had his battery explode on him. POPFIZZLE! It was just sitting on t…

You scared me a bit, as I'm using 0.25 ohm. Can you explain what's the problem or provide some resources to read? I was pretty scared of ecigs before, seeing so many exploding.

[deleted]

Re: Safer to Puff, E-Cigarettes Can’t Shake Their Reputation as a Menace

#127

Post by vivekd »

I used e-cigarettes to quit smoking and I can attest that they did work for me. Although my friend and brother tried it as well without any success - so I guess its an individual thing.

Although I would recommend e-cigs as a temporary quit smoking aid only and not as a replacement. I noticed I got more lung infections while vaping and my brother noticed the same thing. Also I wouldnt trust some of the flavors out there, they put anything in there. So if its a temporary measure taken as a quit smoking aid, great, as an alternative to cigs - that Im still on the fence about.

Re: Safer to Puff, E-Cigarettes Can’t Shake Their Reputation as a Menace

#128

Post by troncheadle »

elorant wrote: post #27
thirdsun wrote: post #14

For anyone looking to quit smoking I can't recommend e-cigarettes enough. As a very passionate former smoker I got off the habit pretty much accidentally and without even trying in a timeframe of about half a year. And it actually started with the intend to find a cheaper alternative to expensive cigarettes without any desire to quit. The key is to steadily reduce the amount of nicotine in the liquid you're using. On…

As a former smoker I believe that the best way to quit smoking is cold turkey. Sure, the withdrawal phase is a hell but in my case that helped me realize just how addictive that shit was. Before I’d never imagine that quitting would cause me depression or sleeping problems. All that, and a lot more, helped me understand how much my body was reliant on cigarettes. From my experience most smokers don’t realize how addi…

I'm with you for that reason. It can be a real wakeup call. I thought I had just grown more irritable and less social -- turns out I was just seriously addicted to nicotine.

Re: Safer to Puff, E-Cigarettes Can’t Shake Their Reputation as a Menace

#129

Post by badsock »

thirdsun wrote: post #14

For anyone looking to quit smoking I can't recommend e-cigarettes enough. As a very passionate former smoker I got off the habit pretty much accidentally and without even trying in a timeframe of about half a year. And it actually started with the intend to find a cheaper alternative to expensive cigarettes without any desire to quit. The key is to steadily reduce the amount of nicotine in the liquid you're using. On…

This, IMO, is a good reason to legalize and regulate all drugs, including hard drugs like heroin and meth. The user having the tools to regulate the potency and amount of the drug in order to use this taper-down strategy is not available via the black market.

Re: Safer to Puff, E-Cigarettes Can’t Shake Their Reputation as a Menace

#130

Post by mos_basik »

nsxwolf wrote: post #114
salemh wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Indeed. What e-cigarettes have done for me, and a few friends who have quit smoking, is help alleviate (my friends, who then later completely quit all e-ciggs), or replace (myself) the habitual addiction of cigarettes. Namely, the act of puffing, exhaling, and the sociability of going outside, etc. That's a big part of the cigarettes many persons (anecdota) have trouble with quitting outside of the addictive properti…

What stops you from becoming addicted to the e-cig for the same reasons?

Caveat: I've never smoked or vaped, but I have plenty of friends that do both.

I think the idea is that when vaping, you are able adjust the level of nicotine you are consuming without having to adjust how often you engage in the physical act of vaping/smoking. The act is a comfortable ritual, a chance to take a break, step away, relax for a few moments, whatever. It's a habit itself, distinct from the nicotine dependency. Quitting smoking is doubly painful if you are craving both the chemical and the act. Vaping gives you the act without the chemical.

This doesn't even touch the fact that nicotine is not particularly harmful - simply a habit-forming stimulant like caffeine, adderall or modafinil. Vaping delivers the nicotine without the tar, and the tar is what kills. The thing that makes people nervous about vaping is not the nicotine, but the behavior of the (largely unstudied and unregulated) substances in the vapor being inhaled.

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