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British Government loses Article 50 court fight

bbc.co.uk

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Re: British Government loses Article 50 court fight

#51

Post by ck425 »

michaelt wrote: post #31
nicolapede wrote: post #15

I think it was quite arrogant from Theresa May to decide not to involve the Parliament in the first place. People did not give a blanket mandate to her for implementing whatever she thinks Brexit means.

The article says parliament will get a vote on whether to invoke Article 50. As I understand things, there was a vote on leaving the EU, and the UK voted to leave. And as I understand things, there's only one way to leave the EU, and that's by invoking Article 50. Seems to me that means there was a referendum on whether to invoke Article 50, and people voted to invoke it. Why should MPs get to block the referendum re…

Because the referendum was only advisory, something that was stated clearly at the start. Both sides were aware going into the referendum that invoking article 50 would ultimately be decided by parliament.

Re: British Government loses Article 50 court fight

#52

Post by cmdkeen »

aembleton wrote: post #36
cmdkeen wrote: post #20

Mrs May has a 14 point lead in the polls and justification to call an election were Parliament to block Article 50. Given the current state of the opposition, their leader, and the fact that many Labour seats voted Leave it is a pretty safe bet that the Conservatives could end up with a 100+ majority. The key thing comes down to what "block Article 50" means. If the Government decide to not give ground during the Par…

But she can't just call an election without agreement from 67% of MPs due to the fixed term parliament act.

That's the thing about Parliament being Sovereign it could pass an Act saying "notwithstanding the Fixed Term Parliament Act the next election is on X" and call an election. It could also just repeal the Fixed Term Act.

Re: British Government loses Article 50 court fight

#54

Post by throwaway-hn123 »

elcct wrote: post #45
midgetjones wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I really wish they'd stop calling it a "clear majority". I'm not sure when 52-48 was ever such.

But whatever they call it, it is majority indeed and that's the democracy - you either accept that majority wins or well... don't know

Or realise that the 52-48 reflects a point in time, that things change and therefore it's perfectly ok to campaign against brexit, and try to stop it.

Or do you subscribe to the point of view that we should only have had a single general election and abide by that result for all time?

Re: British Government loses Article 50 court fight

#55

Post by slmyers »

elcct wrote: post #45
midgetjones wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I really wish they'd stop calling it a "clear majority". I'm not sure when 52-48 was ever such.

But whatever they call it, it is majority indeed and that's the democracy - you either accept that majority wins or well... don't know

I'm not sure if you can describe modern democracies as a will of the majority -- marijuana legalization, civil rights movements, anti war sentiments as examples.

Re: British Government loses Article 50 court fight

#56

Post by hexiedexie »

UK-AL wrote: post #7
astannard wrote: post #2

This put a big smile on my face. I do wonder how many people have had a change of heart after the facts came out.

Not many

6% of leave voters regret their choice according to an academic study published about a month ago, enough to swing the vote the other way.... And as the effects of a potential Brexit continue to bite, this percentage will only increase

http://www.britishelectionstudy.com/bes-resources/brexit-bri...

Re: British Government loses Article 50 court fight

#57

Post by return0 »

elcct wrote: post #45
midgetjones wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I really wish they'd stop calling it a "clear majority". I'm not sure when 52-48 was ever such.

But whatever they call it, it is majority indeed and that's the democracy - you either accept that majority wins or well... don't know

The referendum is a poll. UK has representative, parliamentary democracy.

Re: British Government loses Article 50 court fight

#58

Post by pmuk »

midgetjones wrote: post #38
SideburnsOfDoom wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

MP's are in a hard place because of this. The majority of them are pro-remain, having concluded that brexit is damaging and dangerous and cannot result in a better deal. ... but they will be whipped into line by government (Tory) and party leadership (Labour) insisting that they follow the settled will of the clear majority of the people ... but the will of the people is neither settled nor a clear majority.

I really wish they'd stop calling it a "clear majority". I'm not sure when 52-48 was ever such.

Narrow majority would be more accurate.

Re: British Government loses Article 50 court fight

#59

Post by ldjb »

nicolapede wrote: post #15

I think it was quite arrogant from Theresa May to decide not to involve the Parliament in the first place. People did not give a blanket mandate to her for implementing whatever she thinks Brexit means.

Parliament is involved in the Brexit process, including through the Brexit Select Committee. Politicians from across different parties will have their say on how the UK leaves the EU.

However, the British people have voted to leave the EU, and it would be an affront to democracy if the will of the people were denied by Parliament. It would be unacceptable for Parliament to vote against triggering Article 50, so why even vote if there is only one valid outcome?

Re: British Government loses Article 50 court fight

#60

Post by Zelmor »

tobltobs wrote: post #34

It is the same screenplay as in Switzerland and their MEI referendum [1]. Difference is just that the Brits managed to trash all lot of porcelain before they will blink. [1] https://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/sep/06/swiss-eu-stand...

I didn't know about Horizon2020 and Erasmus, thanks for sharing. I do know decisions ought to happen before March 2017, when shit would hit the fan for the Swiss. It would be a shame, it is a country I would definitely would like to live in sometimes in the future.
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