Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

British Government loses Article 50 court fight

bbc.co.uk

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

31–40 of 316 posts

Re: British Government loses Article 50 court fight

#31

Post by michaelt »

nicolapede wrote: post #15

I think it was quite arrogant from Theresa May to decide not to involve the Parliament in the first place. People did not give a blanket mandate to her for implementing whatever she thinks Brexit means.

The article says parliament will get a vote on whether to invoke Article 50.

As I understand things, there was a vote on leaving the EU, and the UK voted to leave. And as I understand things, there's only one way to leave the EU, and that's by invoking Article 50.

Seems to me that means there was a referendum on whether to invoke Article 50, and people voted to invoke it. Why should MPs get to block the referendum result?

Re: British Government loses Article 50 court fight

#32

Post by ranko »

usgroup wrote: post #11

This was frankly unexpected. I wonder what P(supreme=no|high=yes) ? If anyone knows please say. Will the gov bother appealing? The ruling makes available a sabateurs toolbox and could potentially delay Brexit for some time. My bet is that the government don't appeal and then go onto put serious media pressure on parliament to pull the trigger quickly. Having said that I was definitely betting that the high court woul…

Leaving the EU necessarily entails amending or (more likely) repealing the European Communities Act 1972. It's pretty fundamental to the UK constitution that this can only be done by parliament, which makes the judgment entirely expected in legal terms.

Re: British Government loses Article 50 court fight

#33

Post by emp_zealoth »

SideburnsOfDoom wrote: post #24
agd wrote: post #12

For those who don't follow British politics this is very significant. - Invocation of Article 50 is likely to be delayed from Q1 as the legislation will go through parliament and the (hostile) House of Lords. - A 'hard' Brexit is less likely due to incoming amendments from remainer MPs and Lords It also increases the chances of a general election before Article 50 is invoked if the PM feels that MPs will force too ma…

MP's are in a hard place because of this. The majority of them are pro-remain, having concluded that brexit is damaging and dangerous and cannot result in a better deal. ... but they will be whipped into line by government (Tory) and party leadership (Labour) insisting that they follow the settled will of the clear majority of the people ... but the will of the people is neither settled nor a clear majority.

How can they be whipped into pary line? Isn't the worst that can happen to them exclusion from said party?

Re: British Government loses Article 50 court fight

#35

Post by agd »

SideburnsOfDoom wrote: post #24
agd wrote: post #12

For those who don't follow British politics this is very significant. - Invocation of Article 50 is likely to be delayed from Q1 as the legislation will go through parliament and the (hostile) House of Lords. - A 'hard' Brexit is less likely due to incoming amendments from remainer MPs and Lords It also increases the chances of a general election before Article 50 is invoked if the PM feels that MPs will force too ma…

MP's are in a hard place because of this. The majority of them are pro-remain, having concluded that brexit is damaging and dangerous and cannot result in a better deal. ... but they will be whipped into line by government (Tory) and party leadership (Labour) insisting that they follow the settled will of the clear majority of the people ... but the will of the people is neither settled nor a clear majority.

I think it's still likely that they will vote to invoke Article 50, but the leeway they have is with amendments. E.g. Is there enough support for an amendment requiring the UK to stay in the customs union? Possibly.

Re: British Government loses Article 50 court fight

#36

Post by aembleton »

cmdkeen wrote: post #20

Mrs May has a 14 point lead in the polls and justification to call an election were Parliament to block Article 50. Given the current state of the opposition, their leader, and the fact that many Labour seats voted Leave it is a pretty safe bet that the Conservatives could end up with a 100+ majority. The key thing comes down to what "block Article 50" means. If the Government decide to not give ground during the Par…

But she can't just call an election without agreement from 67% of MPs due to the fixed term parliament act.

Re: British Government loses Article 50 court fight

#38

Post by midgetjones »

SideburnsOfDoom wrote: post #24
agd wrote: post #12

For those who don't follow British politics this is very significant. - Invocation of Article 50 is likely to be delayed from Q1 as the legislation will go through parliament and the (hostile) House of Lords. - A 'hard' Brexit is less likely due to incoming amendments from remainer MPs and Lords It also increases the chances of a general election before Article 50 is invoked if the PM feels that MPs will force too ma…

MP's are in a hard place because of this. The majority of them are pro-remain, having concluded that brexit is damaging and dangerous and cannot result in a better deal. ... but they will be whipped into line by government (Tory) and party leadership (Labour) insisting that they follow the settled will of the clear majority of the people ... but the will of the people is neither settled nor a clear majority.

I really wish they'd stop calling it a "clear majority". I'm not sure when 52-48 was ever such.

Re: British Government loses Article 50 court fight

#39

Post by gutnor »

jstanley wrote: post #29
Tomte wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Involving Parliament instead of letting the Government do whatever it wants is democracy.

Letting parliament vote on something after everybody has already had the chance to vote on it is not democracy, it's letting the political elite overrule the decision of the people.

The government is the political elite, expect some you didn't vote (directly) for. If you voted for a MP that is a political elite that you despise and you believe that he is not representing your interest, you voted wrong !

edit: to take a not controversial example - Boris is part of the Government. Cameron was the government too.

Re: British Government loses Article 50 court fight

#40

Post by padolsey »

jstanley wrote: post #29
Tomte wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Involving Parliament instead of letting the Government do whatever it wants is democracy.

Letting parliament vote on something after everybody has already had the chance to vote on it is not democracy, it's letting the political elite overrule the decision of the people.

Referendums in the UK are, legally, glorified opinion polls and so any resulting democratic mandate is spurious.
Post reply on HN