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Ask HN: Who is firing?

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Re: Ask HN: Who is firing?

#151

Post by dfraser992 »

tehwalrus wrote: post #120
kristianp wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What's the difference between being fired and laid off?

In the UK, "getting fired" or "getting the sack" means you were incompetent (or commited misconduct) and are sent home. For incompentance, they can only do this after a "performance review" (they have to give you 3 months to improve, I think). "Laid off" is called being "made redundant". The company can do this much more easily to a bunch of people, but it generally has to pay them ~6 months salary and can't hire new…

You forgot about being 'sent to Coventry' - i.e. the company doesn't want to pay you redundancy, and can't fire you for incompetence, so you get ignored, not given any work, get put in a useless role, etc until you wise up and quit/find another job. British passive aggressiveness at its finest!

Being American. I would have had no problem with being fired aka 'you're now surplus' and it would have been far more helpful (i.e. get it over with) vs. letting me twist in the wind for a few months... or even have a hard talk with me to see if I might be useful elsewhere in the company because I was bored etc.

But the procedure they used to downsize the workforce earlier that year before that was cruel - straight out of the Victorian era...

Re: Ask HN: Who is firing?

#152

Post by hocuspocus »

Raed667 wrote: post #98
1474295912 wrote: post #96

VisualMeta GmbH in Berlin. They're a 'start-up' backed by Axel Springer, Berlin. They fired about 60-70 people recently, some of them on their first day of work. Most of their devs come from non-existent countries (China/Eritrea/Pakistan etc) and they're paid abysmally (€32-34k). It's a surprise that this news wasn't covered at all in Berlin start-up press.

34k € is a bad salary in Germany? Because I think it is an average 1st salary in France (or the companies I've been talking to are also planning to get me paid abysmally )

Social contributions are a much bigger part of your gross salary in Germany. 34k would be ~28k in France.

My company hires new grads around 50k and I guess decent startups who make people relocate across continents should pay at least 45k.

Re: Ask HN: Who is firing?

#154

Post by throwaway1892 »

Raed667 wrote: post #98
1474295912 wrote: post #96

VisualMeta GmbH in Berlin. They're a 'start-up' backed by Axel Springer, Berlin. They fired about 60-70 people recently, some of them on their first day of work. Most of their devs come from non-existent countries (China/Eritrea/Pakistan etc) and they're paid abysmally (€32-34k). It's a surprise that this news wasn't covered at all in Berlin start-up press.

34k € is a bad salary in Germany? Because I think it is an average 1st salary in France (or the companies I've been talking to are also planning to get me paid abysmally )

As another said, it is heavily dependent on location.

For a dev job around Paris, it is very low.

Re: Ask HN: Who is firing?

#155

Post by dig1 »

anon2020 wrote: post #90
jennisNo wrote: post #63

Acorns is not firing people, but has already lost ~15 top performers due to poor executive leadership

The same is happening to Funding Circle in the UK. The company is still profitable, but a lot of devs are leaving because of certain decisions.

Funny, four days ago I've read they are looking for backend devs...

Re: Ask HN: Who is firing?

#156

Post by willthames »

dfraser992 wrote: post #151
tehwalrus wrote: post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In the UK, "getting fired" or "getting the sack" means you were incompetent (or commited misconduct) and are sent home. For incompentance, they can only do this after a "performance review" (they have to give you 3 months to improve, I think). "Laid off" is called being "made redundant". The company can do this much more easily to a bunch of people, but it generally has to pay them ~6 months salary and can't hire new…

You forgot about being 'sent to Coventry' - i.e. the company doesn't want to pay you redundancy, and can't fire you for incompetence, so you get ignored, not given any work, get put in a useless role, etc until you wise up and quit/find another job. British passive aggressiveness at its finest! Being American. I would have had no problem with being fired aka 'you're now surplus' and it would have been far more helpfu…

Sent to Coventry appears to be Constructive Dismissal under UK law

https://www.gov.uk/dismissal/unfair-and-constructive-dismiss...

Of course it might not be worth the lawsuit.

Re: Ask HN: Who is firing?

#158

Post by vertex-four »

kelnos wrote: post #140
tehwalrus wrote: post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In the UK, "getting fired" or "getting the sack" means you were incompetent (or commited misconduct) and are sent home. For incompentance, they can only do this after a "performance review" (they have to give you 3 months to improve, I think). "Laid off" is called being "made redundant". The company can do this much more easily to a bunch of people, but it generally has to pay them ~6 months salary and can't hire new…

No, we use the terms the same way in the US, just the protections behind them are weaker (and personally, as an employee, I'm fine with it that way). You might be thinking of the phrase "was let go", which is just a nicer way of saying "got fired". "Laid off" here means the same as in the UK: you were sent home because your job function isn't needed anymore, or because the company is downsizing.

> and personally, as an employee, I'm fine with it that way

You mean as a reasonably well-off employee who was lucky enough to have picked a growing field when you went to uni. On the other hand, if that field ever stops growing for any reason... you might see why people enjoy stability and the ability to plan ahead in their work life.

Re: Ask HN: Who is firing?

#160

Post by b4xt3em4n »

1474295912 wrote: post #112
Raed667 wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

34k € is a bad salary in Germany? Because I think it is an average 1st salary in France (or the companies I've been talking to are also planning to get me paid abysmally )

34k ain't bad, but average salaries for Experienced Java devs with 5+ years of experience are in the range of 50-55k. Also by paying less than blue card limit, the devs are basically tied to VisualMeta. Most of the devs don't know German system well and thus are being taken advantage of.

34k will be very good salary for an experienced java dev in Italy..
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