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The Cancelled Comma One Would Have Embarrassed the Car Industry

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Re: The Cancelled Comma One Would Have Embarrassed the Car Industry

#111
Remember a few weeks ago when it was a headline that the "going rate" for talented engineers working on self-driving cars was $10 million per head?[1] Meanwhile, comma.ai the company only got $3.1 million from a big-name investor?[2] Yeah, don't quit your day job...

[1] http://www.recode.net/2016/9/17/12943214/sebastian-thrun-sel...

[2] http://money.cnn.com/2016/04/04/technology/george-hotz-comma...

Re: The Cancelled Comma One Would Have Embarrassed the Car Industry

#112

> Hotz's initial tweets suggested his move was in response to an inquiry from NHTSA, stating that he "would much rather spend life building amazing tech than dealing with regulators and lawyers," well, this is not some stupid web-app that can't harm anyone even if it tried (except from maybe overheating your smartphone). This can kill people, i can't seriously buy dangerous stuff from somebody that says something lik…

> stupid web-app that can't harm anyone even if it tried (except from maybe overheating your smartphone)

It can leak very sensitive personal data. That won't hurt you physically but will surely have consequences. The problem is perhaps the lack of regulations in the web-app domain. Any amateur can call himself a programmer and many do.

Re: The Cancelled Comma One Would Have Embarrassed the Car Industry

#113

This is a bit of weak spin on the obvious news that they probably couldn't comply with the government requirements.

Yeah, this article is pretty shallow and has pretty significant levels of fanboy-ism. Like "The little meaningful criticism of Tesla Autopilot (with its state-of-the-art “Autosteer") is rooted in what critics deem insufficient transition warnings" ... the fact that it killed someone notwithstanding. TFA also seems convinced that there is a large difference between the autonomous capabilities of the Model S vs. other…

This paragraph from the article is so stupid it reads like a satire on Silicon Valley:

> Does anyone really believe Hotz would give up with $3M+ in the bank and VC firm Andreessen Horowitz behind him? Hotz could have responded to NHTSA. He just didn't want to. With a lean operation, a growing pool of crowdsourced data and seemingly unlimited swagger, Hotz just bought himself press, time and additional mythos.

Re: The Cancelled Comma One Would Have Embarrassed the Car Industry

#114
post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, maybe the reason is that these regulator requests costs tons of money to fulfill because no, you cannot you give simple laymans answers to the questions, you need a team of lawyers to do this work, because everything you say in these "simple" requests can and will be used against you. And perhaps there are better uses of their time, and better regulatory environments where they can release their product. Maybe…

> Maybe in a couple months we are going to hear about the imminent release of the Comma Two in Not-America. I seriously doubt they've gone home. There are tons of places where they could starting selling right NOW. Then I'm very thankful for the NHTSA we have in America. I don't want a bunch of half-ass, poorly-engineered self-driving cars on our roads. I use those roads, and so do my family members. While I'm lookin…

The guy that you're replying to seems to have no idea how these things work. I worked for an automotive manufacturer in India (hardly a paragon of virtue in terms of regulatory strictness), and we had rules about even seemingly-inane stuff like the HVAC being able to cool the car down in a certain amount of time, and maintain a given temperature overnight on a cold night etc.

You can't just walk in being an arrogant, know-it-all whiz kid and demand that the rules be bent and mere mortals be forced to step aside in deference to your superior intellect.

Re: The Cancelled Comma One Would Have Embarrassed the Car Industry

#115
post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You would have won so much Irony Points if only you had written "Producing food without following proper hygiene regulations? Disrupting the medicine industry with revolutionary tests without sufficient scientific validation?"

Let me introduce to you: Theranos

We all got that. ;)

Re: The Cancelled Comma One Would Have Embarrassed the Car Industry

#116
Worth noting that Alex Roy and Hotz probably have/had a business/working/personal relationship:

"From August 24th-27th of 2016, Roy and teammates Warren Ahner & Streetwars founder Franz Aliquo broke the Electric & semi-Autonomous Cannonball Run records again, driving a Tesla Model S 90D 2,877 miles from the Portofino Inn to the Red Ball garage in 55 hours, breaking the prior record by 2 hours & 48 minutes. Tesla Autopilot was engaged 97.7% of the journey. GPS data and video evidence was captured using both a US Fleet Tracking device, and Comma.ai's Chffr video logging software."[0]

It would not be a leap to assume that Roy might have a vested interest in puffing up his acquaintance. Also, Alex Roy is a "journalist" insofar as he probably got paid to write that piece. But other than that...

[0]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alex_Roy

Re: The Cancelled Comma One Would Have Embarrassed the Car Industry

#117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>What's next? Producing food without following proper hygiene regulations? Boy do I have the product for you! Question: Do you like the color beige?

I prefer the old school green, in the original formulation.

Random historical reference on green: "anti-establish mint" has to be the best car color ever ('69-71, Ford).

http://blog.macsautoparts.com/wild-paint-colors/

Re: The Cancelled Comma One Would Have Embarrassed the Car Industry

#118
The only embarrassed entity here is George Hotz. I find it extremely hard to come up with a charitable narrative in all this but at least the system appears to be working: hacked together crap is not going to be sold to consumers.

It's one thing to break other systems, it is an entirely different thing to produce safety critical software systems interacting in real time with hardware under real world conditions and it is not a given that someone who is good at the one will also be good at the other.

Re: The Cancelled Comma One Would Have Embarrassed the Car Industry

#119
post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, maybe the reason is that these regulator requests costs tons of money to fulfill because no, you cannot you give simple laymans answers to the questions, you need a team of lawyers to do this work, because everything you say in these "simple" requests can and will be used against you. And perhaps there are better uses of their time, and better regulatory environments where they can release their product. Maybe…

> Maybe in a couple months we are going to hear about the imminent release of the Comma Two in Not-America. I seriously doubt they've gone home. There are tons of places where they could starting selling right NOW. Then I'm very thankful for the NHTSA we have in America. I don't want a bunch of half-ass, poorly-engineered self-driving cars on our roads. I use those roads, and so do my family members. While I'm lookin…

> Then I'm very thankful for the NHTSA we have in America. I don't want a bunch of half-ass, poorly-engineered self-driving cars on our roads. I use those roads, and so do my family members.

That sounds like you think that other countries would allow "a bunch of half-ass, poorly-engineered self-driving cars on our roads"?

As an EU citizen, I can assure you that this is widely off the mark.

Re: The Cancelled Comma One Would Have Embarrassed the Car Industry

#120
post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The cover letter was very "do not blow off the NHTSA". One commenter who had experience with NHTSA provided examples of orders they sent other companies with similar language.

I assume you mean this comment? https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12819423 The listed special orders were the pretext to $70m, $35m and $105m fines. Doesn't inspire confidence. It might just be reporting bias, but I couldn't find an example of a special order that wasn't associated with a massive scandal.

The idea is that you comply with the request, not ignore it. Those fines only kick in if you decide to go ahead anyway.
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