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DMCA exemption for repairs, modifications, research on your vehicle takes effect

ifixit.org

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Re: DMCA exemption for repairs, modifications, research on your vehicle takes effect

#81

Post by e12e »

jasonkostempski wrote: post #72
alasdair_ wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To be fair, most forms of property come from government-granted rights. The very idea that you can own land is kind of weird when you think about it.

It's not really weird when you think about ownership just being a bunch of people agreeing to mess up anyone that tries to take something you've claimed. It takes a lot of work to maintain such an agreement, so people have to be compensated for it. If they aren't compensated to their liking, they'll take that thing and maybe other things you've claimed and maybe ruff you up for good measure.

"A bunch of people agreeing" is what a government is?

Re: DMCA exemption for repairs, modifications, research on your vehicle takes effect

#82

Post by sdfjkl »

ex3ndr wrote: post #80
sdfjkl wrote: post #74

ObQuote: "If a law is unjust, a man is not only right to disobey it, he is obligated to do so." -- Thomas Jefferson

Well, this is common rule for russia - disobeying stupid laws, but, believe me, you don't want this. In such conditions everything is simple - you are always guilty.

I certainly didn't want this, but it seems we've had it for some time now. And I see no reason to celebrate winning back a small, limited exception from an unjust law that should never have existed.

Re: DMCA exemption for repairs, modifications, research on your vehicle takes effect

#84

Post by Fargren »

e12e wrote: post #81
jasonkostempski wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not really weird when you think about ownership just being a bunch of people agreeing to mess up anyone that tries to take something you've claimed. It takes a lot of work to maintain such an agreement, so people have to be compensated for it. If they aren't compensated to their liking, they'll take that thing and maybe other things you've claimed and maybe ruff you up for good measure.

"A bunch of people agreeing" is what a government is?

Almost. A governments is a bunch of people agreeing plus the power of those people to punish those who do not agree, without being punished back.

Re: DMCA exemption for repairs, modifications, research on your vehicle takes effect

#85

Post by artmageddon »

hueving wrote: post #27
foxfired wrote: post #21

One thing that I thought was funny about the hackers remotely hacking the Jeep, is that after the article was published and posted here, an HN user went on and reported them to them to High Way patrol. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9921987

And the HN user that reported them did the right thing IMO. Ethical research is a thing. The user reported them to hi-po not because they were 'hacking', but because they intentionally created a dangerous situation on a highway by stalling a car, which could have gotten multiple people killed. It's similar to the guy that decided to connect to the turbofan with his laptop on a populated passenger airplane in flight .

> The user reported them to hi-po not because they were 'hacking', but because they intentionally created a dangerous situation on a highway by stalling a car, which could have gotten multiple people killed.

Not due to hacking, but a few weeks ago I had been involved in an accident because a Mercedes SUV randomly shut down in the middle of the Belt Parkway in Brooklyn, and I had to stop in a line of cars behind said SUV while the driver behind me didn't stop in time. Luckily no one was killed(one injury, not me, but my car got totaled) but had there been any involvement in their part on something like that, I would've lawyered up and sued Wired.

Re: DMCA exemption for repairs, modifications, research on your vehicle takes effect

#87

Post by shmerl »

qwertyuiop924 wrote: post #15

How did the DMCA ever get passed? It's an absolutely insane, ludicrous set of laws. I'm going to start selling shirts that say "Today I Broke The DMCA". No matter who wears it, it's probably true.

Corrupted undemocratic policymaking. See here: https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2013/03/ustr-secret-copyright-...

Re: DMCA exemption for repairs, modifications, research on your vehicle takes effect

#88

Post by philfrasty »

kwiens wrote: post #19
philfrasty wrote: post #11

Is this like a non-profit wing / initiative of the ifixit.com company?

iFixit is a social mission driven company. Just about everything we've done over the last ten years has been to expand the right to repair and make it possible for everyone to fix every thing they own. But there are a whole lot of other organizations also interested in making repair more legal and affordable, and they wanted to start contributing time and funds. So we started Repair.org with them. There's a bunch of…

Thanks so much for taking the time to clarify!

Re: DMCA exemption for repairs, modifications, research on your vehicle takes effect

#89

Post by e12e »

Fargren wrote: post #84
e12e wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"A bunch of people agreeing" is what a government is?

Almost. A governments is a bunch of people agreeing plus the power of those people to punish those who do not agree, without being punished back.

I'd argue the "power to punish without being punished back" stems from "being a bunch of people that agree" - ie: a bigger bunch of people than any one sub-group they might want to punish for being in disagreement.

Then there's the shift in power that comes from control over weapons and infrastructure ... but AFAIK the coordinated masses still have power on their side - partly from the assumption that given enough "external" disagreement, some people on the inside are likely to cross over.

Indeed, one could argue that the most terrifying part about the Snowden disclosures on mass surveillance, is that the current government is poised to deploy counter-measures long before any opposition consolidates and organizes. This might take the form of buying out individuals - or "dissappearing" or taking out individuals that are perceived to be in the process of becoming important.

Re: DMCA exemption for repairs, modifications, research on your vehicle takes effect

#90

Post by posterboy »

nercht12 wrote: post #41
tiglionabbit wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I thought patents were an incentive to invest in research and development. Without patents, anyone who invests in research is at a disadvantage because when they come up with something good, their competitors can copy them at no cost.

Once upon a time, they did serve a purpose for people such as Edison who got ripped off right and left, or so I'm told. These days, it's more about putting money in lawyers' pockets because that alleged "protection" technically isn't free: you have to pay someone to defend it. That's why the little guy still goes under. Not to mention his patent might overlap with someone else's just enough for them to try to sue him…

>[Patents] did serve a purpose for people such as Edison who got ripped off right and left, or so I'm told

He didn't work alone, did he? I think he had a company, but you can bet he got a sweet deal with his employees on those patents.

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