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General questions about the Airbnb Community Commitment

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Re: General questions about the Airbnb Community Commitment

#61

Post by dazc »

zabeltech wrote: post #56

I have personally experienced that many hosts do not like to rent to young males. Some even restrict this in their description i.e "only for females". I hope this discrimination ends now

As a male (who is not actually young) I accept a hosts preference not to rent males (young or old). It would save a lot of time if they clearly stated such (some don't for obvious reasons).

If they have a lot of reviews it's easy to see but if (as is often the case) they don't then you don't know until they reject your booking. And, even then, it isn't so clear cut.

Re: General questions about the Airbnb Community Commitment

#62

Post by jacquesm »

Pinckney wrote: post #40
mahyarm wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can legally discriminate in some categories in shared living situations in many places although. You can legally say you want only female or male roommates, or no couples and so on. And you can do it for money, it doesn't matter if your renting or own the place. If you are renting a place outright, then you cannot. So in that aspect you are allowed to do that.

Right, but how many people actually rent their own residence on Airbnb?

Everybody, and only for a few days per year ;)

Re: General questions about the Airbnb Community Commitment

#63

Post by jacquesm »

aikah wrote: post #16
avar wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Did you just not read two paragraphs below that where it says "What if I decline the commitment?", or do you just think it's pertinent for some reason? Seems pretty clear: You can't discriminate, if you do we terminate your account at our discretion. Edit: I read the question only in the narrow sense of "what if you refuse to accept the new policy" v.s. "what if you break the policy once you accept it?". The answer t…

> "What if I decline the commitment?", It doesn't explain what happens if one accepts the commitment and still discriminates. > Seems pretty clear: You can't discriminate, if you do we terminate your account at our discretion. That's not what the text says. The text basically says : "If you don't answer Yes to the commitment, we will terminates your account". It doesn't say "if you actually do discriminate we will te…

It would be quite nice to see how they intend to prove that a host discriminated.

Re: General questions about the Airbnb Community Commitment

#64

Post by jacquesm »

curun1r wrote: post #41
empath75 wrote: post #21

I think this is long past due. For some background. http://www.nytimes.com/2016/08/23/opinion/how-airbnb-can-fig...

But it's the wrong way to go about it. The right way would be to make the initial negotiation phase blind...no pictures or names, just profile information like star ratings and how long they've been an AirBnB member. Hosts that back out of agreed upon reservations too often could be punished. A vague "I promise not to discriminate" agreement with no details about how discrimination is reported, dealt with and and how…

Yes, but then many people would no longer use Airbnb to host their property. See, the ability to discriminate is what is built right into the platform, and Airbnb knowingly enables this because they will make more money that way. They don't really care if you discriminate or not, they do really care that they are seen as being non-discriminating themselves.

That's why this is worded the way it is.

Re: General questions about the Airbnb Community Commitment

#65

Post by gaur »

jacquesm wrote: post #47

Airbnb can do whatever they want in property they own/lease. However since they 'share' (funny word that) people's private homes they will have to live with the fact that those people will refuse guests for whatever reasons they feel like, this is the flip side of the coin of not having a relationship where they are in control (employer, employee, owner of the premises). Airbnb wants to have its cake and eat it too,…

> After all, what proof will they use to tell a host they are discriminating.

Testers. That's partially how the government got evidence to sue Trump in the 1970s for housing discrimination.

Re: General questions about the Airbnb Community Commitment

#66

Post by [deleted] »

jacquesm wrote: post #47

Airbnb can do whatever they want in property they own/lease. However since they 'share' (funny word that) people's private homes they will have to live with the fact that those people will refuse guests for whatever reasons they feel like, this is the flip side of the coin of not having a relationship where they are in control (employer, employee, owner of the premises). Airbnb wants to have its cake and eat it too,…

[deleted]

Re: General questions about the Airbnb Community Commitment

#67

Post by jacquesm »

gaur wrote: post #65
jacquesm wrote: post #47

Airbnb can do whatever they want in property they own/lease. However since they 'share' (funny word that) people's private homes they will have to live with the fact that those people will refuse guests for whatever reasons they feel like, this is the flip side of the coin of not having a relationship where they are in control (employer, employee, owner of the premises). Airbnb wants to have its cake and eat it too,…

> After all, what proof will they use to tell a host they are discriminating. Testers. That's partially how the government got evidence to sue Trump in the 1970s for housing discrimination.

That doesn't scale. If Airbnb were to test every host to reliably prove discrimination or not their whole business model would fall apart.

Re: General questions about the Airbnb Community Commitment

#68

Post by Vintila »

jacquesm wrote: post #59
Vintila wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, Airbnb can do what they want with their property, namely their website and business. If you don't like it then they even outline what you can do in the linked article. This knife cuts both ways.

They are extending 'their website and business' into private property. That's a direct conflict without resolution, I confidently predict nothing will change and this is just window-dressing. Yes indeed, Airbnb can do what they want with their property, namely their website and business, and their customers property is not their business. > if you don't like it then they even outline what you can do in the linked art…

I feel like this in argument which has been had so many times on HN but >They are extending 'their website and business' into private property.

They offer a service with terms, you either accept those terms or you don't no one is forcing you to use their service.

On the matter of enforcement, I agree this would be near impossible to enforce in all but the most obvious of cases of discrimination.

Re: General questions about the Airbnb Community Commitment

#69

Post by DanBC »

jacquesm wrote: post #59
Vintila wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, Airbnb can do what they want with their property, namely their website and business. If you don't like it then they even outline what you can do in the linked article. This knife cuts both ways.

They are extending 'their website and business' into private property. That's a direct conflict without resolution, I confidently predict nothing will change and this is just window-dressing. Yes indeed, Airbnb can do what they want with their property, namely their website and business, and their customers property is not their business. > if you don't like it then they even outline what you can do in the linked art…

Or AirBnB will face increasing levels of regulation, somewhat like the NYT did under the Fair Housing Act.

http://www.nytimes.com/1993/08/14/nyregion/times-adopts-a-ne...

Re: General questions about the Airbnb Community Commitment

#70

Post by jacquesm »

Vintila wrote: post #68
jacquesm wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They are extending 'their website and business' into private property. That's a direct conflict without resolution, I confidently predict nothing will change and this is just window-dressing. Yes indeed, Airbnb can do what they want with their property, namely their website and business, and their customers property is not their business. > if you don't like it then they even outline what you can do in the linked art…

I feel like this in argument which has been had so many times on HN but >They are extending 'their website and business' into private property. They offer a service with terms, you either accept those terms or you don't no one is forcing you to use their service. On the matter of enforcement, I agree this would be near impossible to enforce in all but the most obvious of cases of discrimination.

Those terms and conditions are meaningless without across the board enforcement.
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