George Hotz cancels his Tesla Autopilot-like ‘comma one’ • Hacker News Board

Re: George Hotz cancels his Tesla Autopilot-like ‘comma one’

#111

Post by throwaway2016a » Fri, Oct 28, 2016, 5:12 PM UTC

6stringmerc wrote: post #104

jacquesm wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's an incredibly reasonable list and something anybody active in the self driving car space should be more than happy to answer in the required detail.

After working for half a decade with RFPs and SMEs, I'd like to politely clue you in that "knowing the answers" and "putting the answers to paper in a reasonable time" are two completely different monsters. I was paid a reasonable salary to deal with the gap between the two. It is one your comment so severely underestimates it's borderline farce. Sorry.

True but he said he planned to release the product by end of year... surely he at least had drafts of this information. The letter even said estimates were OK.

Re: George Hotz cancels his Tesla Autopilot-like ‘comma one’

#112

Post by bpicolo » Fri, Oct 28, 2016, 5:12 PM UTC

6stringmerc wrote: post #105

bpicolo wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I mean, they apparently have a clause trying to entirely deny liability. That's not really a reasonable spot.

Can you show me if Tesla's is fundamentally different? I'm sincerely curious.

Afaik they don't have people signing waivers, so I imagine they must have gone through a lot of regulatory hurdles? They definitely talk about people needing to be attentive in ways, but I don't personally know the extent of it. "Tesla autopilot liability /waivers" didn't come up any relevant stuff.

Re: George Hotz cancels his Tesla Autopilot-like ‘comma one’

#113

Post by defen » Fri, Oct 28, 2016, 5:12 PM UTC

6stringmerc wrote: post #98

Do I think Hotz has a viable product? Yes. (A comment over at Jalopnik linked to a Tweet where an actual human rider / journalist experienced the Hotz vehicle and was quite impressed) Do I think there's significant political pressure to have his product, ahem, driven into the ground as to not be a viable competitor to larger firms? Yes. Do I think it's a sign of immaturity to pack up your stuff and leave when confron…

> Do I think Hotz has a viable product? Yes. (A comment over at Jalopnik linked to a Tweet where an actual human rider / journalist experienced the Hotz vehicle and was quite impressed)

Journalists being shown demos in controlled circumstances are a notoriously unreliable source of information about the viability of a product.

Re: George Hotz cancels his Tesla Autopilot-like ‘comma one’

#114

Post by nzjrs » Fri, Oct 28, 2016, 5:13 PM UTC

Hopefully his example is shown to every engineering class along side the Tacoma Narrows bridge collapse example.

He is truly an example of an irresponsible engineer and a great lesson to learn from.

Re: George Hotz cancels his Tesla Autopilot-like ‘comma one’

#115

Post by hellameta » Fri, Oct 28, 2016, 5:13 PM UTC

lawnchair_larry wrote: post #106

Nobody who is familiar with George is surprised by this. It's unfortunate that his ego has a scapegoat, however. I guess this time he couldn't find anyone on IRC to finish the hard parts for him and let him take the credit.

IRC? Is there more to this?...

Re: George Hotz cancels his Tesla Autopilot-like ‘comma one’

#116

Post by hartator » Fri, Oct 28, 2016, 5:14 PM UTC

Analemma_ wrote: post #16

He's currently throwing a temper tantrum on Twitter, and all because the NHTSA wanted to ask him a few questions about the product (you can see it here: https://www.scribd.com/document/329218929/2016-10-27-Special... ). Like, how dare the government try to have basic standards for multi-ton hunks of metal hurtling down the highway without human input. I've been trying to convince people lately that Silicon Valley isn…

Sure, but now he left from China. It's our lost not his.

Re: George Hotz cancels his Tesla Autopilot-like ‘comma one’

#117

Post by devy » Fri, Oct 28, 2016, 5:14 PM UTC

tetrep wrote: post #2

a little more detail from techcrunch: https://techcrunch.com/2016/10/28/comma-ai-cancels-the-comma... It seems that Hotz said, “dealing with regulators and lawyers… isn’t worth it.” Which seems very unfortunate/shortsighted due to how useful this tech could be. Why not hire someone to deal with them for you?

> Why not hire someone to deal with them for you?

It's either taking a long time in order to be in compliance / certified or very costly or both.

Hotz mentioned a 2016 end of year shipping date, it's impossible to do that if they have to "dealing with regulators and lawyers".

Re: George Hotz cancels his Tesla Autopilot-like ‘comma one’

#118

Post by phusion » Fri, Oct 28, 2016, 5:15 PM UTC

Analemma_ wrote: post #16

He's currently throwing a temper tantrum on Twitter, and all because the NHTSA wanted to ask him a few questions about the product (you can see it here: https://www.scribd.com/document/329218929/2016-10-27-Special... ). Like, how dare the government try to have basic standards for multi-ton hunks of metal hurtling down the highway without human input. I've been trying to convince people lately that Silicon Valley isn…

Did he delete all of his tweets? Just found his verified account and it's empty.

Re: George Hotz cancels his Tesla Autopilot-like ‘comma one’

#119

Post by throwaway2016a » Fri, Oct 28, 2016, 5:16 PM UTC

nibs wrote: post #5

Classic government. Self-driving technology should benchmarked against how good people are at driving (and how often they kill and injure people), as opposed to being proven intrinsically safe like a car part.

They didn't ask him to prove it is safer than human drivers. They essentially asked him for documentation showing it does not actively make the car less safe.

Re: George Hotz cancels his Tesla Autopilot-like ‘comma one’

#120

Post by hartator » Fri, Oct 28, 2016, 5:16 PM UTC

gavman wrote: post #102

Analemma_ wrote: post #16

He's currently throwing a temper tantrum on Twitter, and all because the NHTSA wanted to ask him a few questions about the product (you can see it here: https://www.scribd.com/document/329218929/2016-10-27-Special... ). Like, how dare the government try to have basic standards for multi-ton hunks of metal hurtling down the highway without human input. I've been trying to convince people lately that Silicon Valley isn…

Exactly. The NHTSA memo seems extremely reasonable to me. If you're going to put to market a product where the smallest malfunction could easily kill many people (both those using your product and those around them), answering a couple regulation questions seems like a small hurdle to pass. Nothing here is saying "we want to shut you down", it's saying "we want to make sure you pass the most basic safety standards".…

I feel $21,000 fine per day sounds pretty like "we want to shut you down". He never presented comma.ai as an autopilot but as a very smart line assist and adaptive cruise control.