FCC Vote Means Internet Providers Need Permission to Share Your Data • Hacker News Board

Re: FCC Vote Means Internet Providers Need Permission to Share Your Data

#31

Post by devindotcom » Thu, Oct 27, 2016, 9:56 PM UTC

metaphorm wrote: post #26

devindotcom wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You have to opt in and there can't be a penalty for opting out, the fact sheet says. That said, there may be a bonus for opting in — perks or whatnot. That will have to be settled separately, probably.

it's really hard for me to understand what the meaningful difference would be between penalty for opting out vs. bonus for opting in. don't those amount to the same thing, in practice?

heh pretty much yes, though I'm sure someone can think of times it would be different. and since penalties for opting out are not allowed, the ISPs will have to be very careful how they structure such bonuses - they would have to be perks totally separate from the service they provide is my guess.

Re: FCC Vote Means Internet Providers Need Permission to Share Your Data

#32

Post by jahewson » Thu, Oct 27, 2016, 9:57 PM UTC

metaphorm wrote: post #26

devindotcom wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You have to opt in and there can't be a penalty for opting out, the fact sheet says. That said, there may be a bonus for opting in — perks or whatnot. That will have to be settled separately, probably.

it's really hard for me to understand what the meaningful difference would be between penalty for opting out vs. bonus for opting in. don't those amount to the same thing, in practice?

Yes, the difference is just playing with words. Rewarding those who opt-in is materially equivalent to penalising those who opt-out. I don't think the FCC would stand for such shenanigans.

Re: FCC Vote Means Internet Providers Need Permission to Share Your Data

#33

Post by ncallaway » Thu, Oct 27, 2016, 10:00 PM UTC

devindotcom wrote: post #31

metaphorm wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

it's really hard for me to understand what the meaningful difference would be between penalty for opting out vs. bonus for opting in. don't those amount to the same thing, in practice?

heh pretty much yes, though I'm sure someone can think of times it would be different. and since penalties for opting out are not allowed, the ISPs will have to be very careful how they structure such bonuses - they would have to be perks totally separate from the service they provide is my guess.

It probably has to do with the advertised price.

They probably can't advertise service as $49.95, then add an additional $20 charge if you opt-in to the privacy plan.

They probably would need to at minimum advertise both prices in their marketing copy.

Re: FCC Vote Means Internet Providers Need Permission to Share Your Data

#34

Post by cunotaco » Thu, Oct 27, 2016, 10:06 PM UTC

afarrell wrote: post #28

I wish the UK had this. Mobile phone/data providers send a header with HTTP requests to provide the site with your phone number which they can then use to charge you without permission.

As far as I know that only happens with trusted partners of your mobile provider.

Re: FCC Vote Means Internet Providers Need Permission to Share Your Data

#35

Post by cloudjacker » Thu, Oct 27, 2016, 10:14 PM UTC

Permission like an android app

Re: FCC Vote Means Internet Providers Need Permission to Share Your Data

#36

Post by devindotcom » Thu, Oct 27, 2016, 10:16 PM UTC

Interestingly there seems to be a loophole in that they can collect the data regardless of consent, but can't use or share it without consent. So chances are this sensitive data will be recorded and put in a database anyway, even if they're not lawfully allowed to look at it without anonymizing first - but a future law could also add an exception, keeping things for law enforcement for instance.

I'm triple checking with the FCC on this though.

Re: FCC Vote Means Internet Providers Need Permission to Share Your Data

#37

Post by initram » Thu, Oct 27, 2016, 10:27 PM UTC

ncallaway wrote: post #33

devindotcom wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

heh pretty much yes, though I'm sure someone can think of times it would be different. and since penalties for opting out are not allowed, the ISPs will have to be very careful how they structure such bonuses - they would have to be perks totally separate from the service they provide is my guess.

It probably has to do with the advertised price. They probably can't advertise service as $49.95, then add an additional $20 charge if you opt-in to the privacy plan. They probably would need to at minimum advertise both prices in their marketing copy.

Though inevitably the privacy one will be an asterisk and written in 3 point font in light gray text against a light gray background.

Re: FCC Vote Means Internet Providers Need Permission to Share Your Data

#38

Post by initram » Thu, Oct 27, 2016, 10:30 PM UTC

cunotaco wrote: post #34

afarrell wrote: post #28

I wish the UK had this. Mobile phone/data providers send a header with HTTP requests to provide the site with your phone number which they can then use to charge you without permission.

As far as I know that only happens with trusted partners of your mobile provider.

For some reason that makes it way worse in my book. It isn't some scumbags running a sketchy website you were tricked into clicking on - it's the very people you've entrusted to give you service.

Re: FCC Vote Means Internet Providers Need Permission to Share Your Data

#39

Post by rhizome » Thu, Oct 27, 2016, 10:30 PM UTC

metaphorm wrote: post #26

devindotcom wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You have to opt in and there can't be a penalty for opting out, the fact sheet says. That said, there may be a bonus for opting in — perks or whatnot. That will have to be settled separately, probably.

it's really hard for me to understand what the meaningful difference would be between penalty for opting out vs. bonus for opting in. don't those amount to the same thing, in practice?

I bet legally there's no difference and the dog won't hunt.

Re: FCC Vote Means Internet Providers Need Permission to Share Your Data

#40

Post by swissoak » Thu, Oct 27, 2016, 10:31 PM UTC

It's just a breath of fresh air to see a part of our government working to protect consumer interests to the detriment of giant corporate interests. What is it about the FCC that makes it less susceptible to the conflicts of interest from lobbying found elsewhere in politics?