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The “432 Hz vs. 440 Hz” conspiracy theory

jakubmarian.com

71–80 of 332 posts

Re: The “432 Hz vs. 440 Hz” conspiracy theory

#72
post #54

Fascinating stuff. I have never pondered the arbitrariness of musical tunings (probably because I am not a musician). However, if these tunings and notes vary so much, what does it mean when one claims that they have 'perfect pitch'? Is it an ability that uses the relative distance between notes? That is, given an A they can identify the C?

> given an A they can identify the C

this is relative pitch

> what does it mean when one claims that they have 'perfect pitch'

someone starting before 6 years old (better chance of things sticking) and being sung "bah-bah-black sheep" with a piano at the correct pitch. So they manage to remember the starting pitch as well as the relative up/down of the melody.

Interestingly, more common in "tonal" language speakers, e.g. Mandarin, where the pitch can make a difference in the meaning of the same word. Apparently "ma" can mean mom, horse, lazy... depending on the pitch and its direction.

Perfect pitch is mostly a curse than a blessing as many notes in the world are off, e.g. a school bell, and hurt the person with the perfect pitch. I hear :)

Re: The “432 Hz vs. 440 Hz” conspiracy theory

#73
Moral of the story is that numbers with dimensions totally arbitrary. In theoretical physics you often want to find a small parameter to do a Taylor expansion and make some mathematical expression simpler. A small parameter is a number much less than one, but if we have a quantity with the units of metres for example, we cannot say "r is much less than 1" because you can't compare a number with dimensions to one. You could always pick your units such that the number is much less than 1. What you instead do is find some _ratio_ of quantities that is much less than one, because then the units cancel and you have a dimensionless quantity that you can then compare to 1.

Re: The “432 Hz vs. 440 Hz” conspiracy theory

#74

Prince was also big into the 432 Hz thing vs. 440. 432 on guitar feels a little nicer overall but I like to play along to radio / DJ mixes for fun & practice and being at 432 feels off to me, so I stick with 440. 432 is good on acoustic, but then again open tuning sounds good on acoustic no matter if using 432 or 440.

I like playing bass tuned slightly flat because I have tiny hands and it's easier to play with less tension.

Neat! I can understand. Also like how some guitarists who sing prefer to tune to Eb. I think it's more of a sonic fit for some registers.

I've always wanted to play heavy strings, so I also explored tuning down. Imagine my surprise seeing what Dimebag Darrell was tuning to for "Floods" on 'Great Southern Trendkill' - C# F# B E G# C. I had trouble getting intonation that worked well for me, so I went ahead and got a Les Paul style Baritone. Definitely a workout, and the opposite of going lighter, but I really dig the tone it puts out. Worth the hand cramps to practice on the 27" scale.

Re: The “432 Hz vs. 440 Hz” conspiracy theory

#75
post #46

Decided to try searching this and found this lovely site: > A=432 Hz, known as Verdi’s ‘A’ is an alternative tuning that is mathematically consistent with the universe. Music based on 432Hz transmits beneficial healing energy, because it is a pure tone of math fundamental to nature https://attunedvibrations.com/432hz/ Oh new age pseudo science. My mom loves this stuff and I never fully understood why. My sister gets…

Star Wars is nonsense too but it makes people happy.

Nonsense spreads not just because of apathy.

Re: The “432 Hz vs. 440 Hz” conspiracy theory

#76
I have been following this for years, being both a sound engineer and a bit of a hippie who knows a lot of other hippies. The basic issue is that 432 is a numerologically interesting number compared to 440. So if it's more interesting it should be better for artistic purposes, goes the argument. However this falls flat as soon as you consider that the 432 is only interesting relative to the completely arbirtrary duration of a second. There is nothing special about the second from a human psychoacoustic point of view. We could have standardized on a longer or shorter time interval, but since we'd been using the Babylonian-originated divisions for centuries in the west the second is what we ended up with.

But unless the music also contains some 1Hz modulation (or a power-of-two multiple thereof) then the 432 base frequency isn't related to anything fundamental in musical terms. Speaking as a DJ, if you take a track and play it a little bit faster or slower it still sounds great or awful as at the default speed in most cases. 432Hz vs 440Hz is a ~2% difference, while DJ equipment commonly allows for +/-10% pitch variation so you can match the pace of different tracks smoothly while people are dancing. Only the very tiny number of people with perfect pitch find this disorienting to listen to. If there were really something special about the duration of the second and the base pitch relative to that, you'd have expected it to emerge from dancefloors years ago. In reality 432Hz is basically cargo cult numerology, something fun to think about when you are not having any success coming up with a kickass tune. And kickass tunes derive their quality from the relative rations of the note pitches, not from some absolute Magic Frequency.

Trust me on this. I really love numerology, sacred geometry and so on, and I try to integrate this into my artistic work regardless of medium. I would love for there to be some special key that would unlock the gate to cosmic/ biological/ quantum harmony and allow my artistic work to automatically echo the heartbeat of the universe. I'm a mystic by temperament and have been looking for such things my whole life. I would go so far as to say I have some religious faith in the significance of such things. But this ain't it.

Re: The “432 Hz vs. 440 Hz” conspiracy theory

#77
Orchestras in Europe mostly use 442 pitch. This was really started because the recording industry liked a more "brilliant" sound. It also lead to some disastrous destruction of old string instruments which couldn't withstand the high pressure of steel strings being tuned to 442 to and broke.

Re: The “432 Hz vs. 440 Hz” conspiracy theory

#79
post #19

> the BBC required their orchestras to tune to 440 Hz instead of 439 Hz because 439 is a prime number, and the corresponding frequency is hard to generate electronically. I followed, until this. Earlier he debunks the significance of 432 per second (including that it's a sum of four consecutive primes), because a second is an arbitrary length of time. But now he says that 439 per second is difficult to generate elect…

Maybe if your "electronics" are vacuum tubes and relays.

In the digital domain it's not an issue at all.

Re: The “432 Hz vs. 440 Hz” conspiracy theory

#80
post #22
post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Dial tones are a chord of 440 and 350 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Precise_Tone_Plan This follows on from DTMF's use of pairs of tones for signalling. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dual-tone_multi-frequency_sign...

I love the scene in Adaptation where a tripping Meryl Streep and Chris Cooper harmonize the dial tone chord while talking on the phone.

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