Elon Musk's finances • Hacker News Board

Re: Elon Musk's finances

#11

Post by anindha » Sun, Oct 23, 2016, 1:34 PM UTC

JimmyAustin wrote: post #10

forgotpwtomain wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Most of the environmental impact of a car is in its manufacturing Do you have a reference for this?

https://www.theguardian.com/environment/green-living-blog/20...

It depends on the car you own, the one you are buying and how much you drive. If you don't drive a lot and have a fuel efficient car, keep the car.

If you own a Land Rover and drive a lot, buying a Tesla you'd be up over a few years.

http://www.greencarreports.com/news/1093657_buying-a-new-car...

Re: Elon Musk's finances

#12

Post by ulfw » Sun, Oct 23, 2016, 1:38 PM UTC

anindha wrote: post #8

115100 wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most of the environmental impact of a car is in its manufacturing, so global warming is made worse by Tesla selling more cars instead of people buying older ones.

Tesla aims to make their cars last 10 times longer than the average gasoline car. There are less things that can go wrong with an electric car. They are creating ways to increase utility on each car. Less people will need their own car. Edit: I should clarify. Tesla is aiming to make their drive trains last 1m miles. Most car companies don't offer extended warranty past 100k miles. Normal car companies want you to bu…

Ten times longer. Where is the proof in that hyperbole statement? So a Tesla lasts 200 years? And really - lithium ion batteries don't go bad ever?

Of course an electric car needs less maintenance on engine, transmission etc. But it is by no means no maintenance. Especially a Tesla. See all the reports of people reporting how much repairing and maintenance they have to do.

http://gas2.org/2016/05/21/2012-tesla-model-s-needs-8500-bra...

Re: Elon Musk's finances

#13

Post by codeulike » Sun, Oct 23, 2016, 1:39 PM UTC

a business empire with a financial structure that works only if risky companies perform perfectly on ambitious plans

Everyone talks about the wonders of capitalism and how risk is rewarded, but then someone comes along who is actually taking risks to achieve big objectives and the industry watchers collectively shit their pants.

Re: Elon Musk's finances

#14

Post by RealityVoid » Sun, Oct 23, 2016, 1:39 PM UTC

anindha wrote: post #8

115100 wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most of the environmental impact of a car is in its manufacturing, so global warming is made worse by Tesla selling more cars instead of people buying older ones.

Tesla aims to make their cars last 10 times longer than the average gasoline car. There are less things that can go wrong with an electric car. They are creating ways to increase utility on each car. Less people will need their own car. Edit: I should clarify. Tesla is aiming to make their drive trains last 1m miles. Most car companies don't offer extended warranty past 100k miles. Normal car companies want you to bu…

Are you kidding me? 10 times longer lifespan is _huge_, if we assume the average car lasts only 10 years that would mean you'd be able to use a Tesla for 100 years. That is totally not happening, especially with Tesla's reluctance to share maintenance manuals. It seems, on the contrary, that the Tesla cars have lower life-span than classic combustion engine cars.

Re: Elon Musk's finances

#15

Post by japhyr » Sun, Oct 23, 2016, 1:40 PM UTC

anindha wrote: post #8

115100 wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most of the environmental impact of a car is in its manufacturing, so global warming is made worse by Tesla selling more cars instead of people buying older ones.

Tesla aims to make their cars last 10 times longer than the average gasoline car. There are less things that can go wrong with an electric car. They are creating ways to increase utility on each car. Less people will need their own car. Edit: I should clarify. Tesla is aiming to make their drive trains last 1m miles. Most car companies don't offer extended warranty past 100k miles. Normal car companies want you to bu…

Are the advances in battery technology going to allow this? 10 times longer is a long time to own a car; I assume there will be pretty significant improvements in electric cars over that time period.

I wonder if this would just create a massive secondary market for used Teslas?

Re: Elon Musk's finances

#16

Post by RealityVoid » Sun, Oct 23, 2016, 1:41 PM UTC

JimmyAustin wrote: post #9

115100 wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most of the environmental impact of a car is in its manufacturing, so global warming is made worse by Tesla selling more cars instead of people buying older ones.

True, but it's easier to fix those causes. It's a lot harder to take the millions of ICE cars off the road then it is to cleanup the environmental impact of a lithium mine.

It's not about lithium mines per se... it's about needing a new car and not a used one since you're buying a (new) Tesla. That means extra carbon in the atmosphere.

Re: Elon Musk's finances

#17

Post by sweden » Sun, Oct 23, 2016, 1:43 PM UTC

115100 wrote: post #4

xiphias wrote: post #2

The whole article is failing to point out the biggest risks that the clean-tech companies are fighting against: global warming and lung cancer. Even though all older car companies have the ability right now to take a huge financial and PR risk, they're still not talking about the damage car emissions cause. Tesla is the first company that convinced me to buy a new car instead of an 8 year old one, as I didn't see eno…

Most of the environmental impact of a car is in its manufacturing, so global warming is made worse by Tesla selling more cars instead of people buying older ones.

What is a better situation: having a polluting factory making polluting cars or having a polluting factory making eco-friendly cars?

Maybe if the automotive industry had made this step a long ago, we could have been buying old but eco-friendly electric cars right now instead of buying gas/petrol cars.

On another perspective, Tesla is also heavily investing in self-driving technology. So we could even stop buying cars and start using a fleet of unmanned self-driving cars which are also friendly to the environment.

Re: Elon Musk's finances

#18

Post by brador » Sun, Oct 23, 2016, 1:44 PM UTC

xiphias wrote: post #2

The whole article is failing to point out the biggest risks that the clean-tech companies are fighting against: global warming and lung cancer. Even though all older car companies have the ability right now to take a huge financial and PR risk, they're still not talking about the damage car emissions cause. Tesla is the first company that convinced me to buy a new car instead of an 8 year old one, as I didn't see eno…

It's not a risk if we know it exists.

Re: Elon Musk's finances

#19

Post by radiorental » Sun, Oct 23, 2016, 1:45 PM UTC

codeulike wrote: post #13

a business empire with a financial structure that works only if risky companies perform perfectly on ambitious plans Everyone talks about the wonders of capitalism and how risk is rewarded, but then someone comes along who is actually taking risks to achieve big objectives and the industry watchers collectively shit their pants.

> Everyone talks about the wonders of capitalism and how risk is rewarded

Yes, when that risk is spread across the system and the fundamentals are stable ventures.

Point being when all you do is take large risks, that's a problem.

(fwiw: long on tsla)

Re: Elon Musk's finances

#20

Post by rahrahrah » Sun, Oct 23, 2016, 1:46 PM UTC

anindha wrote: post #5

The $400m cash flow from pre-orders is an example of it being easier to tackle hard problems than easy ones. A lot of people would rather risk money in Tesla then make money investing in a bank or an oil company.

What's your point? I would expect that both small banks and small oil companies have very high fail hate, and that the returns on investing in a big bank or big oil company are very small percentage wise.... no?