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The Best Way to Not Get Tenure

blue.cse.buffalo.edu

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Re: The Best Way to Not Get Tenure

#21

Post by blazespin »

code_sardaukar wrote: post #14

I read the whole article and it's very hard to judge the correctness of most of the article's claims. Most importantly, it's hard to judge the most important thing: the author's own research. However, I can say that there are different ways to interpret things. The author sees tenure as a way to establish obedience to the unwritten rules of the department. Based on my knowledge of academia, including friends who were…

"I interpret as .. doing things that might piss off people on the committee."

Sounds like obedience to me.

There's a great HBO tv show, "The Wire". It's all about how an institution can consume personalities of those who belong to it. I'm pretty sure tenure is the same way. I see this happening to people who work in corporations for a long time. Their personalities change as they become the sort of person who can succeed in such environments.

That being said, I suspect standout researchers get tenure and get to be themselves, just as talented people can succeed in corporations and still be themselves.

They are generally the exception rather than the norm, however.

Re: The Best Way to Not Get Tenure

#22

Post by gsylvie »

mcherm wrote: post #2

This article has a powerful and important point to make. But much of the strength of an argument rests on the author's evaluation of his own contributions which is almost unfailingly positive. The article would be even more effective if accompanied by statement from one or more of the eight department members who voted against granting tenure.

He obviously pissed off his department, and so they voted with an aim to punishing him. He's a fool not to appeal it, though. If he appeals then the decision will be made by people outside of his department who won't have the same emotional stakes in the decision. Rage quit after you win your appeal, if you must!

$3,000,000 in funding, most of it still active is astonishing (https://blue.cse.buffalo.edu/proposals/), and his DBLP (http://dblp.uni-trier.de/pers/hd/c/Challen:Geoffrey) is pretty awesome (note: he's in DBLP as Geoffrey Challen, Geoffrey Werner Challen, and Geoffrey Werner-Allen).

But he DID keep his dog in his lab, against university policy: https://web.archive.org/web/20151002100639/http://www.buffal...

I hope he changes his mind about not appealing. The grass ain't greener anywhere else. All university departments are filled with miserable gossips.

Re: The Best Way to Not Get Tenure

#23

Post by pmiller2 »

gregmac wrote: post #7

Why is Tenure still a thing? It's basically a lifetime employment contract. It seems the only argument for tenure is academic freedom.. a tenured professor can pursue an avenue of research without fear of reprisal for it being controversial or not yielding results (though really, even experiments that 'fail' actually serve to prove that it's not the way to go). It seems to be me like this is a problem that can be sol…

> employees in most (every?) jurisdiction are protected by laws that mean they can't be fired without just cause.

The United States is not one of those jurisdictions. Employees can be fired for any reason other than certain protected reasons (race, etc.) One can literally be fired for supporting the wrong political candidate, for example.

Re: The Best Way to Not Get Tenure

#24

Post by blazespin »

totalZero wrote: post #16
muglug wrote: post #5

Most people, when passed over for promotion, don't write about it publicly. One has to wonder what sort of spirit possessed this author.

He's trying to get attention so he can get a job somewhere else: https://blue.cse.buffalo.edu

Yeah, I'm sure departments are just dying to hire someone who will bite them like this if they don't make him happy.

Re: The Best Way to Not Get Tenure

#25

Post by robotresearcher »

KKKKkkkk1 wrote: post #19

How come the three papers that the author cites as examples of groundbreaking work have 2 citations between them? Is this the norm in computer systems?

They were published this year. They'll be cited next year if they are useful. There's a 6-9 month delay between paper submission and publication.

Re: The Best Way to Not Get Tenure

#26

Post by kevhito »

code_sardaukar wrote: post #14

I read the whole article and it's very hard to judge the correctness of most of the article's claims. Most importantly, it's hard to judge the most important thing: the author's own research. However, I can say that there are different ways to interpret things. The author sees tenure as a way to establish obedience to the unwritten rules of the department. Based on my knowledge of academia, including friends who were…

I agree with this. But research isn't everything. And there are at least some hints and signs that this person doesn't know how to get along with colleagues.

> I worked really hard to bring an exciting and rigorous operating systems class to UB.

Why did this effort require working "really hard"? Was it because of obstructionist, jealous, or stupid colleagues? Or people who wanted a boring and unrigourous course instead? Or were there perhaps legitimate reasons why others didn't want to change the existing course?

> I led a complete overhaul of our department’s undergraduate computer science curriculum. It includes two new exciting introductory programming courses that I spent a great deal of time designing.

Let me guess: the existing curriculum was terrible, boring, not at all rigorous, and there was no reason to keep any of it, and the author made sure everyone knew it. And why did the author have to spend a great deal of time? Because no one else in the department was capable of doing as good a job? Because nobody else could comprehend this grand vision?

Everything listed under "speaking out" gives me the same vibe. It doesn't seem to have crossed this person's mind that there are reasons why other people have different approaches to teaching, research, administration, hiring, etc., beyond others being obstructionist, brainwashed, or just stupid. I'm reminded of the parable reminding us [1] to not take down a fence until we have truly understood why the fence was erected in the first place.

And really... bringing a dog to work in violation of a clearly stated campus policy, repeatedly, even after having been warned, then encouraging a student petition and getting your name in a local paper about the incident? That's just asking for trouble.

(Full disclosure: I'm coming up for tenure myself, and one lesson it has taken me 5 years to understand is that people who disagree with me on campus aren't doing so out of spite, stupidity, or carelessness, they often just have different priorities than I do. Just because our department absolutely needs more resources to do a good job handling our rapidly growing student population, doesn't mean the college should make this a priority over other things.)

[1] http://www.chesterton.org/taking-a-fence-down/

Re: The Best Way to Not Get Tenure

#27

Post by skosuri »

gsylvie wrote: post #22
mcherm wrote: post #2

This article has a powerful and important point to make. But much of the strength of an argument rests on the author's evaluation of his own contributions which is almost unfailingly positive. The article would be even more effective if accompanied by statement from one or more of the eight department members who voted against granting tenure.

He obviously pissed off his department, and so they voted with an aim to punishing him. He's a fool not to appeal it, though. If he appeals then the decision will be made by people outside of his department who won't have the same emotional stakes in the decision. Rage quit after you win your appeal, if you must! $3,000,000 in funding, most of it still active is astonishing ( https://blue.cse.buffalo.edu/proposals/ )…

It looks like he also flipped classrooms and was active within the department service-wise. That's a pretty crazy decision not to tenure him from the outside.

Re: The Best Way to Not Get Tenure

#28

Post by kevhito »

gsylvie wrote: post #22
mcherm wrote: post #2

This article has a powerful and important point to make. But much of the strength of an argument rests on the author's evaluation of his own contributions which is almost unfailingly positive. The article would be even more effective if accompanied by statement from one or more of the eight department members who voted against granting tenure.

He obviously pissed off his department, and so they voted with an aim to punishing him. He's a fool not to appeal it, though. If he appeals then the decision will be made by people outside of his department who won't have the same emotional stakes in the decision. Rage quit after you win your appeal, if you must! $3,000,000 in funding, most of it still active is astonishing ( https://blue.cse.buffalo.edu/proposals/ )…

> All university departments are filled with miserable gossips.

They are also filled with people who think their own vision and priorities for the intro programming course, operating systems course, networking course, "entire" undergrad curriculum, department and college resource allocation, and campus dog policy, are obviously the only correct and rational choice, and anyone who disagrees is a miserable gossip.

Re: The Best Way to Not Get Tenure

#29

Post by SolaceQuantum »

kevhito wrote: post #26
code_sardaukar wrote: post #14

I read the whole article and it's very hard to judge the correctness of most of the article's claims. Most importantly, it's hard to judge the most important thing: the author's own research. However, I can say that there are different ways to interpret things. The author sees tenure as a way to establish obedience to the unwritten rules of the department. Based on my knowledge of academia, including friends who were…

I agree with this. But research isn't everything. And there are at least some hints and signs that this person doesn't know how to get along with colleagues. > I worked really hard to bring an exciting and rigorous operating systems class to UB. Why did this effort require working "really hard"? Was it because of obstructionist, jealous, or stupid colleagues? Or people who wanted a boring and unrigourous course inste…

> Why did this effort require working "really hard"? Was it because of obstructionist, jealous, or stupid colleagues?

I was one of the students at UB while this took place. It took a lot of effort, partially because the rewriting involved a lot of student feedback and there was also a massive e-mail discussion (accidentally?) sent to the entire computer science undergraduate mailing list of one of the senior faculty chastizing a more junior faculty over how student feedback was used in remaking the program.

I can't say for anything else (including the dog situation, since I know other faculty in other departments also bring their pets to school), but I know there was some severe and public obstruction from senior faculty to more junior faculty going on during the remaking.

Re: The Best Way to Not Get Tenure

#30

Post by kitanata »

blazespin wrote: post #24
totalZero wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He's trying to get attention so he can get a job somewhere else: https://blue.cse.buffalo.edu

Yeah, I'm sure departments are just dying to hire someone who will bite them like this if they don't make him happy.

I don't understand the mentality where if anyone dares shares their opinion about a former place of employment that has anything remotely negative about the place, that it is looked upon as poor form. It's ridiculous and takes away power from employees and those looking for work. We should openly talk about our experiences in places we work.

Wouldn't it be an unfortunate thing, for someone to get hired into a place that has toxicity in it, when simply warning others may have prevented it? We should side with having empathy for our peers and colleagues, not for our employers and organizations.

In general, this post is mostly positive. It's a reflection on his time there. Does it contain some criticisms? Yes, but to say that he should just shut up, take the beating, and move on is tragic.

He'll have no problem finding employment.

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