What If the Newspaper Industry Made a Colossal Mistake? • Hacker News Board

Re: What If the Newspaper Industry Made a Colossal Mistake?

#21

Post by ci5er » Tue, Oct 18, 2016, 3:29 PM UTC

lisa_q wrote: post #7

JoeAltmaier wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Instead of crowd-sourcing what gets published/visible, trust some anonymous individuals at a newspaper? Who has only one agenda instead of a mixture of many voices and ideals? That's got its downside too. The bubble is created there by what tiny number of voices are included in the subscription list.

"some anonymous individuals at a newspaper" ...you mean professional journalists who actually report on subjects of their expertise?

Maybe a journalist is an expert on whatever it is that they are covering, and maybe they are not. Regardless, they are over-worked, spread-thin and the most erudite probably not universally syndicated.

I've certainly experienced the Gell-Mann Amnesia effect myself (for years!), but each bump up against the practice of modern journalism makes me a little bit more disillusioned (and sad, because it is surely an important function.)

Re: What If the Newspaper Industry Made a Colossal Mistake?

#22

Post by imgabe » Tue, Oct 18, 2016, 3:32 PM UTC

Um, news aggregators need something to aggregate. That content comes from newspapers. The links still send readers to the newspaper's website. The aggregators are not replacing the function of the newspapers, they're just making it easier for readers to find the stories.

Re: What If the Newspaper Industry Made a Colossal Mistake?

#23

Post by JoeAltmaier » Tue, Oct 18, 2016, 3:32 PM UTC

goatlover wrote: post #18

JoeAltmaier wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No I mean editors who determine what makes it on to the printed page.

Editors aren't also professionals who work with the journalists? What you're advocating for is a lot of amateur voices with limited resources in comparison and a plethora of personal agendas. It's more democratic than having a few professional curators. But is that better?

Its varied. That's the point.

Re: What If the Newspaper Industry Made a Colossal Mistake?

#24

Post by jacquesm » Tue, Oct 18, 2016, 3:33 PM UTC

tdb7893 wrote: post #15

jacquesm wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's fresh news, but it is shallow . Quality reporting requires dedication and resources, something some news organizations had under one roof. It's hard to see how that very necessary element in our society will be kept around in the longer term. The 5th estate has a very important function and without it our societies will no doubt be poorer.

You might be interested to know that Buzzfeed seems to be doing investigative reporting now

I just checked out their homepage, let's just say that isn't exactly evident from the content there.

I'm going to assume your comment was sarcastic unless there is some proof to the contrary.

Some samples:

Oh, boy.

34 of the best products from shark tank.

23 texts that will make you laugh way harder than they should.

How much do you actually know about drugs?

Find awesome gifts for friends and family.

27 Ingenious Hacks Every College Student Needs To Know (food, laundry and pooping).

Any of those links qualify as investigative reporting?

Re: What If the Newspaper Industry Made a Colossal Mistake?

#25

Post by JoeAltmaier » Tue, Oct 18, 2016, 3:33 PM UTC

niccaluim wrote: post #19

JoeAltmaier wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No I mean editors who determine what makes it on to the printed page.

Right. So, professional journalists with experience , and who are anything but anonymous.

Except when they are, like with the Economist.

Anyway, they're single voices, not a variety. So bubble.

Re: What If the Newspaper Industry Made a Colossal Mistake?

#26

Post by losteverything » Tue, Oct 18, 2016, 3:36 PM UTC

eggoa wrote: post #5

This article appears to neglect the impact of craigslist and similar services on classified ad revenue. With that revenue gone newspapers are in trouble, mistake or not.

Ever have to place a obituary lately? Nearly $1k! For a medium size market!

Re: What If the Newspaper Industry Made a Colossal Mistake?

#27

Post by ceterum_censeo » Tue, Oct 18, 2016, 3:40 PM UTC

jacquesm wrote: post #24

tdb7893 wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You might be interested to know that Buzzfeed seems to be doing investigative reporting now

I just checked out their homepage, let's just say that isn't exactly evident from the content there. I'm going to assume your comment was sarcastic unless there is some proof to the contrary. Some samples: Oh, boy. 34 of the best products from shark tank. 23 texts that will make you laugh way harder than they should. How much do you actually know about drugs? Find awesome gifts for friends and family. 27 Ingenious Ha…

They did indeed have an investigative unit, but it was recently poached by CNN: http://www.politico.com/media/story/2016/10/cnn-hires-away-b...

e: I don't recall any of their articles specifically, but I do recall reading a few solid articles via Instapaper and then being surprised to see that they were from BuzzFeed.

Re: What If the Newspaper Industry Made a Colossal Mistake?

#28

Post by [deleted] » Tue, Oct 18, 2016, 3:40 PM UTC

jacquesm wrote: post #24

tdb7893 wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You might be interested to know that Buzzfeed seems to be doing investigative reporting now

I just checked out their homepage, let's just say that isn't exactly evident from the content there. I'm going to assume your comment was sarcastic unless there is some proof to the contrary. Some samples: Oh, boy. 34 of the best products from shark tank. 23 texts that will make you laugh way harder than they should. How much do you actually know about drugs? Find awesome gifts for friends and family. 27 Ingenious Ha…

[deleted]

Re: What If the Newspaper Industry Made a Colossal Mistake?

#29

Post by Fricken » Tue, Oct 18, 2016, 3:41 PM UTC

goatlover wrote: post #16

nkozyra wrote: post #10

The conclusion that a drop in readership is proof that moving to the web was a mistake is extraordinarily shallow. "Readers continue to leave print newspapers, but they’re not migrating to the online editions." Because they have more options. Print products were often monopolies, especially in the early to mid 90s, a hey day for newspapers. There was often a single publication per DMA. What happened then is newspaper…

Sacrificing the ideals of journalism sounds like a bad deal for democracy. But then again, if people would rather be entertained by whatever is in their filter bubble for five minutes, than be challenged, I guess that's the kind of news world we get.

I remember my print edition, it was mostly schlock, but every now and then they would do some real investigative local reporting, and that was invaluable. No local source has broken a major, deep, sprawling complex story in years, they're basically just bloggers now, they've got a handful of daily beats they cover, and they don't go much deeper than that. Powerful local organizations operate unchecked.

Re: What If the Newspaper Industry Made a Colossal Mistake?

#30

Post by UweSchmidt » Tue, Oct 18, 2016, 3:41 PM UTC

goatlover wrote: post #16

nkozyra wrote: post #10

The conclusion that a drop in readership is proof that moving to the web was a mistake is extraordinarily shallow. "Readers continue to leave print newspapers, but they’re not migrating to the online editions." Because they have more options. Print products were often monopolies, especially in the early to mid 90s, a hey day for newspapers. There was often a single publication per DMA. What happened then is newspaper…

Sacrificing the ideals of journalism sounds like a bad deal for democracy. But then again, if people would rather be entertained by whatever is in their filter bubble for five minutes, than be challenged, I guess that's the kind of news world we get.

I feel that the local newspaper, or even the common worldview of the major newspapers were/are quite the bubble themselves. Imagine HN without a comment section!

Content algorithms seem to be putting the occasional annoying thing into my feed to keep it fresh, and I keep finding gems of brilliance out of the scope of traditional journalism.