There are some exceptionally toxic comments below.
Indeed. This may be the thread that gets me to leave HN for good. It feels like being inside a history book. It would be fascinating if it weren't so unsettling.
Peter Thiel, YC, and hard decisions
71–80 of 414 posts
Re: Peter Thiel, YC, and hard decisions
#72Earlier quoted context omitted.
There is very much a difference between "uninviting companies " based on their support of a bill and firing a partner for his personal political viewpoints. These aren't apples to apples comparisons; this issue isn't that simple.
YC companies aren't exactly multi-thousand-employee affairs. When you disinvite a YC company, you're really making a value judgment about its founders.
In this context, the companies actually were "mult-thousand-employee affairs", it was a judgement about which large companies were allowed to send investors to Demo Day.
From the article, these are companies like Comcast and Godaddy. It wasn't about actual YC companies.
Re: Peter Thiel, YC, and hard decisions
#73> this isn’t a disagreement on tax policy, this is advocating hatred and violence.
There are still around 40% people voting for Trump and many donating to him, so you mean they are also advocating hatred and violence?
What you believe could be different from others. People can choose different perspectives to see and understand the world. We should encourage different ideas and voices. This post could be downvoted too because I'm supporting and encouraging different voices.
Re: Peter Thiel, YC, and hard decisions
#74Earlier quoted context omitted.
YC companies aren't exactly multi-thousand-employee affairs. When you disinvite a YC company, you're really making a value judgment about its founders.
In this context, the companies actually were "mult-thousand-employee affairs", it was a judgement about which large companies were allowed to send investors to Demo Day. From the article, these are companies like Comcast and Godaddy. It wasn't about actual YC companies.
Okay. I agree, that's different. My mistake.
Re: Peter Thiel, YC, and hard decisions
#75Hang on - Thiel thinks women shouldn't have the right to vote, and has written unambiguously as much?
How on earth is that not the argument for dropping him?
From another angle, how on earth can you trust someone's advice if they truly and honestly think like that?
I'm honestly shocked YC can champion women founders while having someone like this involved as a partner.
Just shocking.
And so, so disappointing.
Re: Peter Thiel, YC, and hard decisions
#76Based on the awful things Trump has said and (apparently) done, it should be blatantly clear to anyone remotely following the election that isn't your usual political rivalry. Pao is right: "this isn’t a disagreement on tax policy, this is advocating hatred and violence." Quite literally at times! (I might give a pass to the people following the party line or acting on incomplete information, but Thiel knows exactly…
> To them, supporting Trump and Clinton are equally bad No, to us destroying a person for their political views is disgusting, even if we disagree with them. A person should not lose their job, their status on a board, their inclusion in an event, etc. based on who they decide to support politically. That's disgusting and people who support that sort of witch hunt should be ashamed of themselves. I vehemently disagre…
In short, you say "people who support that sort of witch hunt" are intolerant, and that there is no place for them here. So... you are in favour of excluding people whose views you find repugnant, it's just a matter of which kinds of intolerance and whose repugnance is involved.
Another matter of interest is the nature of the power imbalance of lack of same. The original witch hunts, McCarthyism, and other struggles involved a very powerful entity depriving individual citizens of their rights to life, liberty, and the pursuit of a career.
There is a massive difference between "So-and-so engineer cannot work in this industry because a VC finds their political views repugnant," and, "I choose not to do business with a billionaire who is actively conspiring to bring democracy down."
One is punching down, the other is punching up, or perhaps sideways.
Re: Peter Thiel, YC, and hard decisions
#77> but we draw a line at individuals who fund violence and hate. (removing video as valid concerns were raised) Although, isn't there evidence that more violence has occurred against trump supporters than anyone else? I am not a supporter by any measure (for one, I'm form the middle east), but I'm trying to understand Paos quote.
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Re: Peter Thiel, YC, and hard decisions
#78Based on the awful things Trump has said and (apparently) done, it should be blatantly clear to anyone remotely following the election that isn't your usual political rivalry. Pao is right: "this isn’t a disagreement on tax policy, this is advocating hatred and violence." Quite literally at times! (I might give a pass to the people following the party line or acting on incomplete information, but Thiel knows exactly…
>This fledgeling authoritarian streak within the tech community really disturbs me.
"Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience." (C.S. Lewis)
Re: Peter Thiel, YC, and hard decisions
#79> His attacks on Black, Mexican, Asian, Muslim, and Jewish people, on women, and on others are more than just political speech; fueled by hate and encouraging violence, they make each of us feel unsafe. Let's assume that not only is Trump a rapist, but that he's keeping a few women tied up in his basement. Even in this scenario, is this worse than Hillary dramatically increasing weapons sales to Saudi Arabia and Qata…
No one else's badness makes him good. Don't vote if you don't like the options. There's no need for us all to lower ourselves to the worst standard. But if apologizing for him is good enough for you, then consider that others have the freedom to forgive, disregard, or otherwise absorb the failings of their candidate.
Also, a "humble opinion" does not call something "complete bullshit" in the same sentence.
Re: Peter Thiel, YC, and hard decisions
#80Has Ellen Pao (and Project Include) spoken out against her husbands alleged Ponzi scheme? His alleged actions seems to be in direct conflict with the values of any wholesome tech company.
That's a textbook deflection right there, and also a logical fallacy.