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WTF is a container?

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Re: WTF is a container?

#121

Post by cookiecaper »

Azeralthefallen wrote: post #101

I remember going to AWS Reinvent last year and having some beers with a bunch of people who did devops. We started talking about tools, and they were utterly flabbergasted, that we had not embraced docker. They went on an on about how simple docker made HA, and handling fail overs/maintenance. More or less made it seem like it was the greatest thing since sliced bread. Me and a few coworkers decided to try and docker…

Yes, Docker is still very young and has a ton of issues like these. I think it will take another 2-3 years before that whole ecosystem has emerged, matured, and is ready for a medium-stability deployment.

Unfortunately for us, such considerations don't stop tech fads. Because containers can allow many more applications to cohabit on the same "hardware", it has business momentum behind it too (lower infrastructure expenditures). "Docker" will be the buzzword until such time as it's actually practical and intelligent to deploy with it.

Re: WTF is a container?

#122

Post by cookiecaper »

vacri wrote: post #82
Philipp__ wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Docker is just overhyped deal with it. There are some nice ideas, but nothing that we couldn't or haven't seen before. FreeBSD Jails and Solaris Zones exist for more than ten years. Where they addressed many things that Docker didn't.

Can you download a BSD Jail image from an application's website, and have it 'just work'?

Yeah, surface simplicity seems to be the heart of what drives tech fads, even if the actual cost in labor and effort is exponentially larger on the back end.

MongoDB? Yes, don't worry about data design or normalization! Just throw that stuff in there, call it anything you want! Finally programmers are free from the tyranny of decent databases. I can't think of any downsides to that arrangement.

Docker? Yeah man, you can just say "docker pull redis" and then you don't even have to bother with Ubuntu getting in your grill with all of its apt-get shenanigans. It's awesome! Now how do we make that port accessible...

Re: WTF is a container?

#123

Post by Keyframe »

dragonsh wrote: post #85
dancek wrote: post #5

I agree that containers (both for shipping and servers) are a great idea. And because I'm tired of always configuring servers, I decided to give it a try some time ago. I wrapped my IRC client (weechat + glowing-bear) in a Docker container. Oh, not a container though, because I also needed https, which meant I needed either a mechanism to build and update letsencrypt certs in the weird format that weechat expects, or…

Containers!=docker, I think if you used lxd container, your experience might have been different as they work like virtual machine. I am using lxd in production and it has been a pleasure with live migration, snapshots and good old configuration management using ansible.

There's also rkt!

Re: WTF is a container?

#124

Post by ksec »

Azeralthefallen wrote: post #101

I remember going to AWS Reinvent last year and having some beers with a bunch of people who did devops. We started talking about tools, and they were utterly flabbergasted, that we had not embraced docker. They went on an on about how simple docker made HA, and handling fail overs/maintenance. More or less made it seem like it was the greatest thing since sliced bread. Me and a few coworkers decided to try and docker…

flabbergasted? Wow this is a new word for me, I have never heard of it. When i first read it in my mind I thought it was a Spanish Football player that used to play for Arsenal, Then Barcelona, and now Chelsea. LoL

Is this word even used anywhere else beyond US? Never heard it used in the UK.

Re: WTF is a container?

#125

Post by [deleted] »

ksec wrote: post #124
Azeralthefallen wrote: post #101

I remember going to AWS Reinvent last year and having some beers with a bunch of people who did devops. We started talking about tools, and they were utterly flabbergasted, that we had not embraced docker. They went on an on about how simple docker made HA, and handling fail overs/maintenance. More or less made it seem like it was the greatest thing since sliced bread. Me and a few coworkers decided to try and docker…

flabbergasted? Wow this is a new word for me, I have never heard of it. When i first read it in my mind I thought it was a Spanish Football player that used to play for Arsenal, Then Barcelona, and now Chelsea. LoL Is this word even used anywhere else beyond US? Never heard it used in the UK.

[deleted]

Re: WTF is a container?

#126

Post by paulddraper »

Philipp__ wrote: post #83
vacri wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can you download a BSD Jail image from an application's website, and have it 'just work'?

No, but I do not see how it is related to my comment. Read more carefully. I didn't say that Jails and Zones did everything that Docker did, yeah DockerHub is cool and I gave them credits for that.

"nothing that we couldn't or haven't seen before"

Re: WTF is a container?

#127

Post by Jefro118 »

ksec wrote: post #124
Azeralthefallen wrote: post #101

I remember going to AWS Reinvent last year and having some beers with a bunch of people who did devops. We started talking about tools, and they were utterly flabbergasted, that we had not embraced docker. They went on an on about how simple docker made HA, and handling fail overs/maintenance. More or less made it seem like it was the greatest thing since sliced bread. Me and a few coworkers decided to try and docker…

flabbergasted? Wow this is a new word for me, I have never heard of it. When i first read it in my mind I thought it was a Spanish Football player that used to play for Arsenal, Then Barcelona, and now Chelsea. LoL Is this word even used anywhere else beyond US? Never heard it used in the UK.

I'm from the UK and I hear "flabbergasted" reasonably often, more often from upper-middle class folks. Maybe a regional thing?

Re: WTF is a container?

#128

Post by gautamdivgi »

dancek wrote: post #41
jbverschoor wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Same here with docker. The ideas are nice as an application, but it's just a pain in the ass. LXC on the other hand is a breeze.

Does LXC provide a way to automatically create new working instances (like a Dockerfile / docker-compose.yml)? I'm not quite grokking LXC in my first 10 minutes of reading...

I think you could create your own lxc template and then create new instances. The other way would be to just clone existing working instances with overlayfs.

Base lxc may be a bit of a pain. Look at lxd - I believe that makes things much much simpler.

Another thing about lxc is the unpriviledged container - which I think is great for security (not sure if docker provides this).

Re: WTF is a container?

#129

Post by paulddraper »

vidarh wrote: post #69
Hondor wrote: post #62

I never quite understood containers and this article makes them seem kind of similar to what OSs already do. How is a container different from just installing all the dependencies along with an application? Coming from a Windows background, this is pretty common to avoid DLL hell. Nobody distributes a Windows application that requires the user to go and install some 3rd party library before it'll work. Isolation from…

> How is a container different from just installing all the dependencies along with an application? Once the image is built, you can get another installation that is guaranteed to be identical. You can do that with VM images too, but you can not reasonably do that if you try to install multiple applications side by side in a single VM without further isolation - there are too many ways they can interact. > Isolation…

> Try to get an application - statically compiled or not - to run across different Linux distributions, and you will see why this matters.

Done. A statically compiled application has no other dependencies.

Re: WTF is a container?

#130

Post by tigershark »

chewchew wrote: post #27
dancek wrote: post #5

I agree that containers (both for shipping and servers) are a great idea. And because I'm tired of always configuring servers, I decided to give it a try some time ago. I wrapped my IRC client (weechat + glowing-bear) in a Docker container. Oh, not a container though, because I also needed https, which meant I needed either a mechanism to build and update letsencrypt certs in the weird format that weechat expects, or…

Docker gives you the building blocks, but that means you have more pieces to arrange and manage. Take a look at Docker Compose if you haven't already, since the Docker CLI only gets you so far when you're creating apps that consist of multiple containers. I think the best approach for your cert issue is to abstract that into a separate service (nginx is an option, but I'd recommend the Rancher approach below). Yes, t…

Seriously? If something crashes continuously in production then the solution is "just pass the --restart=always flag. I really wonder if you guys are really using docker in prod. I would never use something like that to manage important transactions.
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