Obama administration wanted warrantless access rights to most US email
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Re: Obama administration wanted warrantless access rights to most US email
#2If only the silence meant that people were sharpening their pitchforks. Unfortunately, this is the USA -- we would rather die by a thousand paper-cuts than stand up and say "No!"...
Re: Obama administration wanted warrantless access rights to most US email
#3[deleted]
Re: Obama administration wanted warrantless access rights to most US email
#4First, this title editorializes the article, and summarizes it too aggressively.
Second, while I agree that there's a problem here, the DOJ doesn't simply want "warrantless access rights" to "most US email". What it's claiming is more subtle: that mail that is older than a certain threshold and that has been open requires only a court order, and not a bona fide search warrant.
Re: Obama administration wanted warrantless access rights to most US email
#5[deleted]
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Re: Obama administration wanted warrantless access rights to most US email
#6[deleted]
Re: Obama administration wanted warrantless access rights to most US email
#7First, this title editorializes the article, and summarizes it too aggressively. Second, while I agree that there's a problem here, the DOJ doesn't simply want "warrantless access rights" to "most US email". What it's claiming is more subtle: that mail that is older than a certain threshold and that has been open requires only a court order , and not a bona fide search warrant.
You misread. They are claiming that mail older than 181 days or mail that has been opened falls under the lower standard.
Edit: To your main point, I think your emphasis on the fact there is still a court order is misplaced. Of what practical value is a court order if there is no burden to show probable cause (instead only 'relevance to an ongoing investigation'), and you have no opportunity to challenge (or even know about) the order. How many requests under such a standard do you really think are going to be turned down?
Re: Obama administration wanted warrantless access rights to most US email
#8First, this title editorializes the article, and summarizes it too aggressively. Second, while I agree that there's a problem here, the DOJ doesn't simply want "warrantless access rights" to "most US email". What it's claiming is more subtle: that mail that is older than a certain threshold and that has been open requires only a court order , and not a bona fide search warrant.
I'm confused. According to Wikipedia, a search warrant is a court order.
Re: Obama administration wanted warrantless access rights to most US email
#9First, this title editorializes the article, and summarizes it too aggressively. Second, while I agree that there's a problem here, the DOJ doesn't simply want "warrantless access rights" to "most US email". What it's claiming is more subtle: that mail that is older than a certain threshold and that has been open requires only a court order , and not a bona fide search warrant.
You misread. They are claiming that mail older than 181 days or mail that has been opened falls under the lower standard. Edit: To your main point, I think your emphasis on the fact there is still a court order is misplaced. Of what practical value is a court order if there is no burden to show probable cause (instead only 'relevance to an ongoing investigation'), and you have no opportunity to challenge (or even kno…
You're right. Thanks! But, I wasn't moved to comment by the 181 day standard or the "opened" standard, both of which are, excuse my bluntness, retarded. The real issue I have is the fact that there's still a court order involved.
Re: Obama administration wanted warrantless access rights to most US email
#10I'll echo the advice I heard from Phillip Zimmermann back in the early 1990s: If everyone consistently used encryption for all their email (that's 'everyone', and 'all'), then the effectiveness of government access to email would be lowered to a near-moot level. The sheer complexity and resource requirements to decrypt _all_ email traffic would exceed the government's capabilities. I know the NSA has incredible capabilities....but not that incredible.
Yes, I know this creates a new moving target. However, that beats being a sitting duck, though.