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Facebook Has Repeatedly Trended Fake News Since Firing Its Human Editors

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Re: Facebook Has Repeatedly Trended Fake News Since Firing Its Human Editors

#71
post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Many modern political issues do not have a middle ground - take abortion, you are either for choice, or you believe it is infanticide. So let's stop pretending to be unbiased. You're falling into the trap of American politics by making every issue a binary choice. For instance, I find the abortion debate to be such a non-issue and if someone asks me what my stance is, I respond by saying I haven't done enough resear…

You should note that you have the luxury to even consider the issue of abortion because you've already been born.

They are also lucky their parents met, so your point is?

Re: Facebook Has Repeatedly Trended Fake News Since Firing Its Human Editors

#72
post #55
post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> NPR, NYTimes, WaPO Not directed at you specifically, but if you think those sources are unbiased, it just means that you're bad at detecting bias. Edit: Haha, this one struck a chord.

I am completely ok with you directing that comment at me, because I fundamentally disagree with your assessment. I have a pretty complete understanding of current events from reading those sources. For your statement to be valid, you'd have to prove that there is a considerable amount of information missing and is only available via conservative media.

>For your statement to be valid, you'd have to prove that there is a considerable amount of information missing and is only available via conservative media.

No, information may have been made available by biased media, but it may have been presented in such a way to adjust the perceived significance of it.

Take the email scandal for example. Every news outlet provided the information, but there are vastly different conclusions about the importance of it that a reader will be led to draw based on how the information was presented.

Even the headline you were upset about was a logical conclusion given a viewpoint based on the information available about the recent shooting of the police officers.

Information: Two policeman killed by a man who was in the country illegally

Conservative news interpretation: Illegal immigrant a result of poor border control policies by current administration. Therefore, "Obama lets immigrants across border to kill white people."

Liberal news interpretation: Immigration is a touchy subject right now, exclude anything related to it. Therefore, "Two policeman were killed by a person who happened to be a human."

Re: Facebook Has Repeatedly Trended Fake News Since Firing Its Human Editors

#73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It's being supported by the evangelicals who will not remove their vote from Trump on the grounds that they really want that supreme court seat. You make it sound illogical. As a religious conservative, I do really want that supreme court seat. The President has to really ask for permission for everything else (laws, budgets, wars, etc.), but justice nomination is very largely his choice. Don't be surprised if that…

"Very largely his choice" ... then why hasn't the current nominee see a vote in congress?

Okay, that's a pretty fair point. Obama's nominees have had astronomically high wait times.

His average is 35 days, compared to 10-20 days for recent presidents. http://fivethirtyeight.com/datalab/obama-has-waited-longer-f...

Re: Facebook Has Repeatedly Trended Fake News Since Firing Its Human Editors

#74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They really should filter the news to each person's individual bias. It'd just be easier that way. Cognitive dissonance is real and it can cause serious emotional distress. That's not a good way to drive engagement.

Ethically, it's absolutely unconscionable to show people only what they want to see, enabling our worst features to simply fester unchallenged. From a Machiavellian standpoint (read: Thiel or Zuckerberg), this isn't an intelligent long-term strategy, unless your view of how dumb and malleable people are is such that by playing your cards right, so few people would catch on that it would not hurt the bottom line. EDIT…

>so few people would catch on that it would not hurt the bottom line.

People already know about the filter bubble, but they don't actually care. Most people aren't going to Facebook for an unbiased stream of news and they don't like to feel uncomfortable (i.e. be barraged by things that challenge their core beliefs).

Re: Facebook Has Repeatedly Trended Fake News Since Firing Its Human Editors

#75
post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You should note that you have the luxury to even consider the issue of abortion because you've already been born.

They are also lucky their parents met, so your point is?

Tends to be a less inflammatory 'pro life' way of saying, "it's easy to be undecided when the decision isn't about you being murdered." Or something provocative along those lines.

Re: Facebook Has Repeatedly Trended Fake News Since Firing Its Human Editors

#76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> You make it sound illogical. > As a religious conservative, I do really want that supreme court seat. That factors heavily in the decision. Sorry, that's my bias seeping in. I respect your choice. > The President has to really ask for permission for everything else (laws, budgets, wars, etc.), but justice nomination is very largely his choice. Don't be surprised if that factors heavily in my decision. Not nuclear.…

> Personally I think the risks posed by Trump with his thumb on the nuclear button are greater than the lives saved by repealing abortion rights. 10 to 1 you're wrong. https://xkcd.com/1132/

> 10 to 1 one you're wrong. https://xkcd.com/1132/

What are the two scenarios you're referring to? That Trump does or does not contribute to a nuclear war?

Trump trashes everyone who disagrees with him. He will likely increase tensions on the world stage.

Re: Facebook Has Repeatedly Trended Fake News Since Firing Its Human Editors

#77
post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Many modern political issues do not have a middle ground - take abortion, you are either for choice, or you believe it is infanticide. So let's stop pretending to be unbiased. You're falling into the trap of American politics by making every issue a binary choice. For instance, I find the abortion debate to be such a non-issue and if someone asks me what my stance is, I respond by saying I haven't done enough resear…

You should note that you have the luxury to even consider the issue of abortion because you've already been born.

Wow, that's a pretty dim view of humanity you have there. They were also conceived. Should contraceptives be illegal too?

Just because there is a selection bias doesn't mean that the bias results in specifically positive or negative outcome. I could argue that because you were born you are against abortion because you were born too, and my argument would be just as valid. Of course I'm not making that argument, because it is just as silly as the one you are making.

Re: Facebook Has Repeatedly Trended Fake News Since Firing Its Human Editors

#78
post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are plenty of low-quality left-wing news sources too, but the high-quality sources definitely trend to the left for some reason. Breitbart and Huffington Post are both tabloid garbage, but at least there are highbrow counterparts to Huffington Post.

"...definitely trend to the left for some reason." It is the same reason why most movies have a happy ending. It is easier to sell daydreams (histories and world-views) than the harsh reality.

Not really. The right in the US has gone through several compaction cycles that drummed the RINOs, moderate conservatives, blue-dog Democrats, etc out of office and the party. Republicans are far, far away from being a "big tent" party. It's ideological purity or get purged in the primaries.

By virtue of the two-party system in the US there is only one place left for rational thinking people to end up. This election cycle is producing an even stronger compaction cycle than the last three combined. As the base gets ever more rabid and detached from reality more people flee. (Some on the Left are pissed that the Dems have been moderating too much)

I can't predict the future but it is possible we are looking at a major fracture of the GOP and political re-alignment. It has happened 2-3 times in the past. If I had to guess the Rs will fracture into two or more parties, the Ds will run the table for a decade or two, then things will reset as a new party rises to replace the GOP and peels off D voters.

If Donald Trump keeps claiming he lost due to fraud/the media/some other boogeyman I don't see how the Republicans can keep it together. If nothing else he showed the wanna-be hucksters how to really appeal to the hardcore Republican base. Many astute eyes have been watching and will be ready to replicate his efforts at the local and national level. The Right-wing echo chamber has taught the base that all media are liars, you can't trust government, etc. There is no authority left who can tell them what is a false conspiracy theory and what is truth. Anyone who doesn't buy the conspiracies is branded a traitor and the compaction cycle marches ever onward.

Compaction Cycles are where a group turns inward looking for people to blame. Sometimes there is an obvious cause, sometimes it's just general discontent. People point fingers and anyone who isn't quick enough to jump on the group-think train is purged. Moderate or un-committed members are driven out, (see Tea Party candidates primary-ing a bunch of Rs out). If the movement experiences a failure this can manifest as the blame-game too - see McCain/Romney. When they clinched the nomination various places like r/pol and Freep went on huge purges of anyone not backing them. When they lost the group-think proclaimed it was because they weren't true conservatives. Like fascism, communism, and other -isms conservativism cannot fail, it can only be failed. Compromise is a moral failing. If the leaders just /conservatived even harder/ they would finally win.

When Trump inevitably loses (remember: he hasn't been forecasted to win once since he started running and demographic trends make it almost impossible for Republicans to win the presidency anymore) there will be another massive purge and a huge wave of angry people looking to blame someone. A certain segment of the R base won't believe he lost. They will claim the election was stolen.

Re: Facebook Has Repeatedly Trended Fake News Since Firing Its Human Editors

#79
post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ethically, it's absolutely unconscionable to show people only what they want to see, enabling our worst features to simply fester unchallenged. From a Machiavellian standpoint (read: Thiel or Zuckerberg), this isn't an intelligent long-term strategy, unless your view of how dumb and malleable people are is such that by playing your cards right, so few people would catch on that it would not hurt the bottom line. EDIT…

>so few people would catch on that it would not hurt the bottom line. People already know about the filter bubble, but they don't actually care. Most people aren't going to Facebook for an unbiased stream of news and they don't like to feel uncomfortable (i.e. be barraged by things that challenge their core beliefs).

They don't, but they also don't like going to the gym, waking up early for work, or taking out the trash. I think it'll be interesting to see who do and who don't

Willpower and motivation fascinate me. I've been living with depression for a while, but I've been able to conceptually reorient myself to embrace my circumstances and find willpower to do the 'I don't want to, but I should' things whenever they come around. But just as I don't think everyone is capable of advanced systems programming, for example, I'm not certain that everyone is capable of strong willpower.

Re: Facebook Has Repeatedly Trended Fake News Since Firing Its Human Editors

#80

What is the error rate of fake news over verified (real) news? A 5% margin of error could be acceptable. A 50% error rate would indicate a serious problem. > As part of a larger audit of Facebook’s Trending topics, the Intersect logged every news story that trended across four accounts during the workdays from Aug. 31 to Sept. 22. During that time, we uncovered five trending stories that were indisputably fake and th…

This raises the really interesting point that news doesn't have a post mortem process. It would be a very interesting experiment to, say, revisit a sampling of top stories at some interval (say 3-6 months) and compare the reported facts (and omissions) with the actual reality.

From such elements as "did names and places get accurately reported?" to "was the underlying narrative correct?". Quotes and attributions might be a particular element. Predictions (particularly in financial reporting) as well.

This needn't be every article, but some weighted sample based on a story's placement, impact, subsequent references, etc.

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