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Ask HN: Learning to code, without a computer?

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Re: Ask HN: Learning to code, without a computer?

#121

Post by RandomOpinion »

givinguflac wrote: post #44
llamaz wrote: post #23

I'd recommend he read the "structure and interpretation of computer programs". It's written for audience who would, at the time, have found programming novel, but would be at home with math. Hence it's written in a language that allows you to expand out the program by pencil and paper, much the same way you would simplify an equation, to see if it works. Also the following books, which I've copied and pasted from som…

Wow, this is an incredible list. I think this is probably the best first step, and some of the other excellent responses I've got here would be a step two or three. I really appreciate you taking the time to provide these suggestions.

I cannot say I agree that the list of books provided by llamaz is good. The suggestions given so far are college-level CS textbooks (like SICP) and may be too difficult to start with for somebody without the necessary background knowledge. Unless your friend was already a college student in a CS program, I would recommend looking for books and instructional materials targeted at the high-school level instead.

Also bear in mind that without access to a computer or external tutelage, it's going to be very difficult for your friend to know whether or not his code is working properly. Stratoscope's suggestion of hand execution (https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12668865) is a good suggestion to help combat this issue. However, this means most likely that your friend will need to start with a language that's simple in structure; this disqualifies most modern languages. BASIC, Pascal, C or other extremely simple languages will be most amenable to this type of hand execution.

Re: Ask HN: Learning to code, without a computer?

#123

Post by livingparadox »

jmcmahon443 wrote: post #114
informatimago wrote: post #7

Learning to code without a computer is what we all did, 40 years ago! He may write programs on paper, and send them to you to type them in, compile them, and print out a listing with the errors. You then send back the listing, and he will correct his program and repeat. He'll become a great programmer, since he will have to be extra careful to avoid losing one week on some typo. Now, it's been a few years since gcc h…

> Another idea: some progress has been made on optical character recognition, so if he can write well enough, it may be possible that you may be able to scan his written programs, and convert them to source file easily, without having to transcribe them. So the process could be smooth enough. I was going to ask if he has access to a smartphone to take and send photos of paper? Set up a server for it. Hell turn it int…

If he has access to a smartphone, there are some coding environments that run on the phone. No need to run the code in such a roundabout manner.

Re: Ask HN: Learning to code, without a computer?

#124

Post by llamaz »

ajamesm wrote: post #103
llamaz wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He wants to learn to code, not how to become a mathematician. As an EE student, there are plenty of engineers who know nothing about those topics (except maybe linear algebra) that have successfully completed the image processing/computer vision course.

> Mano, M and Kime, C Logic and Computer Design Fundamentals, 2nd ed Prentice Hall, 2001 "Featuring a strong emphasis on the fundamentals underlying contemporary logic design using hardware description languages, synthesis, and verification," You mean to tell me that set theory is too abstract, but full-adders and VHDL are right up his alley.

Nothing is too abstract for a grown adult. It's expected that by that stage you will struggle through whatever is thrown at you. In fact the book list I've copied and pasted are the recommended texts from the "computer engineering 101" class.

The problem is that most mathematicians don't have more than a surface level working knowledge of set theory, because they don't think it's useful. It's even less useful for computer scientists (who use type theory any way).

With the exception of set theory, I've taken the classes you've mentioned, and while they've been very useful for electrical engineering, I don't believe they're useful for software engineering.

Re: Ask HN: Learning to code, without a computer?

#125

Post by anarazel »

hn_felon wrote: post #80

I did 6 years in Texas, but I was already a developer before I went in. That said, I had some books sent to me to try to keep my mind fresh. I also helped someone else who was released a few years after me get going and now they're a junior dev. Emphasize learning that will serve freelancing, since someone with a criminal record will run into issues with traditional employment. (I've been out since 2009 and done very…

Thanks for sharing.

Re: Ask HN: Learning to code, without a computer?

#126

Post by branchless »

llamaz wrote: post #23

I'd recommend he read the "structure and interpretation of computer programs". It's written for audience who would, at the time, have found programming novel, but would be at home with math. Hence it's written in a language that allows you to expand out the program by pencil and paper, much the same way you would simplify an equation, to see if it works. Also the following books, which I've copied and pasted from som…

The Little Schemer, found the style delightful.

Re: Ask HN: Learning to code, without a computer?

#128

Post by j2kun »

Lordarminius wrote: post #52
informatimago wrote: post #7

Learning to code without a computer is what we all did, 40 years ago! He may write programs on paper, and send them to you to type them in, compile them, and print out a listing with the errors. You then send back the listing, and he will correct his program and repeat. He'll become a great programmer, since he will have to be extra careful to avoid losing one week on some typo. Now, it's been a few years since gcc h…

>> He may write programs on paper, and send them to you to type them in, compile them, and print out a listing with the errors. You then send back the listing, and he will correct his program and repeat. I'd pay good money to know what the prison superintendent thinks of this cryptic communication.

As an interesting side note, it turns out books on programming that include chapters on encryption are not allowed in prisons.

Re: Ask HN: Learning to code, without a computer?

#129

Post by pavel_lishin »

mbertschler wrote: post #36

What is the most capable programmable device, that would not be considered a computer by the rules? How about a graphical calculator like a TI-83? While I was stuck in school and did not have access to a computer, I wanted to challenge myself during classes. The most interesting distraction by far was to play around with the programming functions of my TI-82 calculator that was required for math classes. Even with al…

> In the end I even created a clone of snake. It worked, but moving one block ahead would take 2 seconds.

Nice! I ended up creating a Minesweeper clone. I remember the program being really long, and really annoying to write without having access to actual recursion.

Re: Ask HN: Learning to code, without a computer?

#130

Post by ajamesm »

llamaz wrote: post #124
ajamesm wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Mano, M and Kime, C Logic and Computer Design Fundamentals, 2nd ed Prentice Hall, 2001 "Featuring a strong emphasis on the fundamentals underlying contemporary logic design using hardware description languages, synthesis, and verification," You mean to tell me that set theory is too abstract, but full-adders and VHDL are right up his alley.

Nothing is too abstract for a grown adult. It's expected that by that stage you will struggle through whatever is thrown at you. In fact the book list I've copied and pasted are the recommended texts from the "computer engineering 101" class. The problem is that most mathematicians don't have more than a surface level working knowledge of set theory, because they don't think it's useful. It's even less useful for com…

> Nothing is too abstract for a grown adult.

SICP, dearth of practical experience... MIT? Any case, you live in a daycare. Remember we're talking about someone incarcerated.

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