A theory on how insulin resistance, metabolic disease begin • Hacker News Board

Re: A theory on how insulin resistance, metabolic disease begin

#21

Post by debacle » Thu, Oct 06, 2016, 3:14 PM UTC

kefka wrote: post #11

oldmanjay wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've never heard of a connection between consuming animal products and diabetes. Perhaps you can expand on this.

I recognize the text pattern from before. Pretty sure I've dealt with this user before, on articles about Diabetes. In the end, it's a whole lot of breathlessness about veganism will "fix diabetes". Of course, no citations, or cited articles that are completely 180deg out of phase. I know what worked for me, was a form of Atkins diet (extremely low carbohydrate diet) backed up with my glucometer. I plot trends of foo…

What fruits do you allow yourself to eat? I've cut out fruits entirely and miss them greatly.

Re: A theory on how insulin resistance, metabolic disease begin

#22

Post by tremon » Thu, Oct 06, 2016, 3:15 PM UTC

oldmanjay wrote: post #8

dogdutyascetic wrote: post #7

The connection to the consumption of animal products to diabetes is rarely the focus but we know there is a big connection. Consider Kempner's Rice Diet which used sugar to successfully treat diabetes! So I doubt sugar is a sufficient condition. This is politics not science.

I've never heard of a connection between consuming animal products and diabetes. Perhaps you can expand on this.

Given the GP's user name, I suspect that not many share a love for ingesting that kind of "animal product".

Re: A theory on how insulin resistance, metabolic disease begin

#23

Post by debacle » Thu, Oct 06, 2016, 3:17 PM UTC

venomsnake wrote: post #13

dogdutyascetic wrote: post #7

The connection to the consumption of animal products to diabetes is rarely the focus but we know there is a big connection. Consider Kempner's Rice Diet which used sugar to successfully treat diabetes! So I doubt sugar is a sufficient condition. This is politics not science.

Easy to test. Get 80% of your calories from fructose syrup. The rest from plant food. Feel free to report in a year.

> Get 80% of your calories from fructose syrup.

Pretty sure you would die in less than 38 hours.

Re: A theory on how insulin resistance, metabolic disease begin

#24

Post by mchmch » Thu, Oct 06, 2016, 3:23 PM UTC

kefka wrote: post #11

oldmanjay wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've never heard of a connection between consuming animal products and diabetes. Perhaps you can expand on this.

I recognize the text pattern from before. Pretty sure I've dealt with this user before, on articles about Diabetes. In the end, it's a whole lot of breathlessness about veganism will "fix diabetes". Of course, no citations, or cited articles that are completely 180deg out of phase. I know what worked for me, was a form of Atkins diet (extremely low carbohydrate diet) backed up with my glucometer. I plot trends of foo…

You are here often saying this and downvoting people who don't agree with you. Please comment on this:

The Cause of Insulin Resistance What’s gumming up the door locks on our muscle cells, preventing insulin from letting glucose in?

It’s fat. Intramyocellular lipids, or the fat inside our muscle cells.

Fat in the bloodstream can build up inside the muscle cell and create toxic fatty breakdown products and free radicals that can block the insulin signaling process. When that happens, no matter how much insulin we have in our blood, it won’t be able to open the glucose gates. That causes blood sugar levels to build up in the blood.

Source: The article linked in my previous comment. Yes there are sources cited.

Re: A theory on how insulin resistance, metabolic disease begin

#25

Post by Declanomous » Thu, Oct 06, 2016, 3:23 PM UTC

adrianN wrote: post #18

Declanomous wrote: post #16

My capstone project was actually about how sugar affects metabolism. There is a lot of interesting research and unexpected interactions in this area. One of the things that is most interesting is that they have found the same proteins that form our taste buds in the walls of our small intestine. It appears that the gut "tastes" food and "tells" the body what kind of food is coming and how to prepare for it. One of th…

Can you actually measure an insulin spike for a fasting person that eats or drinks some artificial sweeteners?

That's actually a really interesting suggesting for further study. It's probably possible. I don't know if the research has been done though. The discovery of the "taste bud" proteins in the gut was a fairly new when I did my project 5 years ago. I don't have journal access so keeping up to date is fairly difficult.

Side note, I made a video for it as part of my senior capstone. I often think about making an updated version. For one thing, I'm not sure if everything in it is correct. On top of that, I was incredibly tired, because the only time I could reserve the space I needed was after midnight. I also flubbed a few lines and lost all my b-roll, so editing was a nightmare. In any case, here's the video I did:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8ZGSBi0OFwM

There are so many things I'd like to change about that video.

My graduating class was the first one at my college that was required to perform a senior capstone to graduate, so everything was done by the seat of my pants. I learned later that the Biology department actually used my project as the example for what they wanted all projects to be like. It's far from perfect, but my goal was to take what I had learned and share the information in a way the general public could understand.

I was a little overambitious. I learned later that several professors thought I wasn't going to graduate. (I wish I had known that at the time, I would have been doubly motivated.) I'm pretty jealous of the younger students, they turned an old building in to a film studio for producing videos like this. My rig was a bunch of halogen work lights and the best camera I could afford at the time (read: really terrible).

The capstone project is why I'm 100% in favor of requiring open journal access. With journal access, anyone can contribute to the scientific community (and society as a whole). I made a video, but people can come up with their own questions and try to answer them, such as the question you asked. Watching the projects other people are doing on YouTube, I'm 100% convinced that open journal access would lead to a scientific revolution.

Re: A theory on how insulin resistance, metabolic disease begin

#26

Post by petra » Thu, Oct 06, 2016, 3:35 PM UTC

Declanomous wrote: post #16

My capstone project was actually about how sugar affects metabolism. There is a lot of interesting research and unexpected interactions in this area. One of the things that is most interesting is that they have found the same proteins that form our taste buds in the walls of our small intestine. It appears that the gut "tastes" food and "tells" the body what kind of food is coming and how to prepare for it. One of th…

From your description of the issue , it seems that DouxMatok's sweeter sugar technology[1] could solve this dillema - by giving the tongue the same sense of sweetness , but in the gut, where sugar dissolves, only 1/2 of the sugar enters.

[1]By coating inert mineral particles that have no caloric value with sugar molecules, DouxMatok developed a sugar substitute that (allegedly) tastes just like pure sugar.

The sugar-dusted particles have the same amount of sweet surface area as a full sugar particle. Because this is the only part of the particle that touches your tongue, the DouxMatok substitute triggers the same perception of sweetness as real sugar when it hits your sweet taste receptors.

Re: A theory on how insulin resistance, metabolic disease begin

#27

Post by roguecall » Thu, Oct 06, 2016, 3:37 PM UTC

Declanomous wrote: post #25

adrianN wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can you actually measure an insulin spike for a fasting person that eats or drinks some artificial sweeteners?

That's actually a really interesting suggesting for further study. It's probably possible. I don't know if the research has been done though. The discovery of the "taste bud" proteins in the gut was a fairly new when I did my project 5 years ago. I don't have journal access so keeping up to date is fairly difficult. Side note, I made a video for it as part of my senior capstone. I often think about making an updated…

Sci-hub has your back re: open journal access https://scihub22266oqcxt.onion.link/

Re: A theory on how insulin resistance, metabolic disease begin

#28

Post by Declanomous » Thu, Oct 06, 2016, 3:45 PM UTC

petra wrote: post #26

Declanomous wrote: post #16

My capstone project was actually about how sugar affects metabolism. There is a lot of interesting research and unexpected interactions in this area. One of the things that is most interesting is that they have found the same proteins that form our taste buds in the walls of our small intestine. It appears that the gut "tastes" food and "tells" the body what kind of food is coming and how to prepare for it. One of th…

From your description of the issue , it seems that DouxMatok's sweeter sugar technology[1] could solve this dillema - by giving the tongue the same sense of sweetness , but in the gut, where sugar dissolves, only 1/2 of the sugar enters. [1]By coating inert mineral particles that have no caloric value with sugar molecules, DouxMatok developed a sugar substitute that (allegedly) tastes just like pure sugar. The sugar-…

The actual problem is that less sugar enters the blood stream than is tasted. The real solutions are really unexciting, like eating fewer sweetened foods, and eating foods sweetened with natural sugar.

Honestly, my biggest take away from the research is that there is no substitute for eating healthy. For instance, vitamin supplements don't appear to convey the same health benefits as consuming the vitamins in foods in which they naturally occur. There are a lot of reasons for this, but what my take away was that it is easier to eat a balanced diet, than it is to eat a poor diet and then fix it through science. Same goes for health in general really -- it's better to take steps to stay healthy, than it is to lose your health and try to get it back.

Re: A theory on how insulin resistance, metabolic disease begin

#29

Post by kefka » Thu, Oct 06, 2016, 3:46 PM UTC

debacle wrote: post #21

kefka wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I recognize the text pattern from before. Pretty sure I've dealt with this user before, on articles about Diabetes. In the end, it's a whole lot of breathlessness about veganism will "fix diabetes". Of course, no citations, or cited articles that are completely 180deg out of phase. I know what worked for me, was a form of Atkins diet (extremely low carbohydrate diet) backed up with my glucometer. I plot trends of foo…

What fruits do you allow yourself to eat? I've cut out fruits entirely and miss them greatly.

My experience is, I can still have: blueberries, raspberries, blackberries, strawberries (well, some), a little bit of apple (we're talking about splitting a tart apple half with wife), and some grapes.

It's not 100% true, but the more tart, the better in terms of sugars. More fiber also helps slow down absorption... But 10g fructose = 10g fructose, no matter what else you put with it.

EDIT: I figured these out the hard way. Go get a cheap glucometer. ReliOn brand is good at Wal-Mart. $25 meter, 9$/50 strips. And eat foods you like. Test before you eat, and 1/2 hour increments afterwards for 2 hours. Wash-rinse-repeat :) Make your own decisions based on your own health data.

Re: A theory on how insulin resistance, metabolic disease begin

#30

Post by kefka » Thu, Oct 06, 2016, 3:52 PM UTC

cableshaft wrote: post #20

kefka wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Total carbs, I'm not entirely sure. My body reacts to Net Carbs, which is (Total - Fiber). As for net carbs, I eat anywhere from 5-15g Some diabetics cannot subtract fiber, because they respond to the whole load via their glucometer. Fortunately, I'm not one of them.

Ah, you're pretty strictly keto then. I try to follow keto and have had good success with it, but after a month of strict 20 grams of carbs or less, I've relaxed it a bit and I often creep up to 30 or 40 net grams of carbs a day. Still feeling great and losing weight, although perhaps I'd lose a bit faster if I remained stricter about it. I'm also not diabetic, although my A1C numbers were getting close to prediabete…

I'm 6'5", at time of type 2 diagnosis, I was 320 lbs, 44" waistline, a1c=7.1, fasting glucose=161 mG/dL . That was last December. They caught it in time before I really had many symptoms, although I was starting to get erectile dysfunction (one of the first things to cause problems, BTW).

Fast forward to now. 260 lbs, waver between 36" and 38" waistline, and feel better than I have in decades.

My only problem is my stomach is a perfect sensor for "Hidden Carbs". I'll get wonderful things like stomach pains and bad indigestion over things like flour in gravies or sauces, or hidden corn starch, or sugar sprayed on salads.

Now, Metformin. I have a prescription for it. I don't need to take it, UNLESS I'm eating somewhere I cannot control my carb load, let alone know what my carb load is. Holidays are notorious about this, as are buffets and similar places. My solution is, I take metformin before I go to sleep the day before, through the whole day of, and 1 pill the morning after. It effectively is a form of a PID control loop for glucose.... which is what I need.