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Facebook, Amazon, Google, IBM and Microsoft Create Partnership on AI

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Re: Facebook, Amazon, Google, IBM and Microsoft Create Partnership on AI

#251

Post by Razengan »

newscracker wrote: post #202
Razengan wrote: post #115

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> However, Alphabet its influence and reach is far, far beyond that of Apple. Its just not as flashy & visible. You just gave some very "flashy & visible" examples of Alphabet's influence while citing only a "big pile of cash" as Apple's flashy & visible trait. Apple have always been the most secretive and they almost NEVER announce something before they're ready to advertise it. Did anybody see the New Mac Pro redes…

I agree with almost everything you said, except this part. > I think the winds of the world are changing direction; people are becoming increasingly aware about privacy concerns, and these issues keep making the headlines. It seems like only a minority cares about privacy concerns to even understand them well and take some action. Even when privacy issues make the headlines, billions of people just shrug their should…

Yeah, I should've said "I'd like to think/hope the winds are changing" but still, things like all the new messaging apps that make end-to-end encryption a selling point, and services like Skype losing active users at a rapid rate, do point to an undeniable if yet-miniscule effect.

Even during casual conversations with some of my friends who wouldn't be expected to care about these issues, they occasionally let out a glib "Sorry NSA!" whenever they say something that's known to be picked up by their monitoring.

So there is change. There is a chilling effect. And a big player like Apple making a big deal out of it, does help.

Re: Facebook, Amazon, Google, IBM and Microsoft Create Partnership on AI

#252

Post by Houshalter »

pron wrote: post #19

Calling simple statistical clustering algorithms that are tweaked by lots of trial-and-error heuristics "AI" feels like calling those slow two-wheeled electric self-balancing skateboards "hoverboards". Sometimes marketing can be too dramatic.

This stuff has been called AI for decades. Perhaps you are thinking of AGI.

Re: Facebook, Amazon, Google, IBM and Microsoft Create Partnership on AI

#253

Post by taneq »

JabavuAdams wrote: post #52
meira wrote: post #33

> “We want to involve people impacted by AI as well,” said Mustafa Suleyman, co-founder and head of applied AI at DeepMind, a subsidiary of Alphabet. Who believes that this is to favor users, believes in everything.

Actually, the DeepMind people seem quite idealistic. Whether they can maintain that idealism in the face of corporate pressures is another story. The character of the founders and engineers matters. Would you rather have GAI developed by DeepMind / Google, or by Lockheed Martin?

So our choices are to build a peeping tom or a terminator? Whatever we build is likely to be both. (Any open-ended goal necessarily has subgoals of 'acquire information' and 'defend self by force if necessary'.)

Re: Facebook, Amazon, Google, IBM and Microsoft Create Partnership on AI

#254

Post by pron »

Houshalter wrote: post #252
pron wrote: post #19

Calling simple statistical clustering algorithms that are tweaked by lots of trial-and-error heuristics "AI" feels like calling those slow two-wheeled electric self-balancing skateboards "hoverboards". Sometimes marketing can be too dramatic.

This stuff has been called AI for decades. Perhaps you are thinking of AGI.

AGI is a recent term coined precisely because the name AI has become confusing, which is precisely my point. It is also not widely known and used for the large part by people who believe in a sci-fi rapture-like event called the "technological singularity[1]", and so carries a bit of a cultish connotation. It doesn't do much to allay the confusion, though, as the term AI (even if understood to refer to something weaker than AGI) can be confused to be a component of AGI. I imagine that at some point, something called AI may eventually lead to AGI, but we have absolutely no idea whether what we call AI now is even on the right path, so the confusion remains.

It is true that some algorithm has been called AI for decades. It wasn't always this one or anything similar to it. Both Lisp and Prolog were thought to be AI languages at one point.

[1]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Technological_singularity

Re: Facebook, Amazon, Google, IBM and Microsoft Create Partnership on AI

#255

Post by edem »

patkai wrote: post #168
thr0waway1239 wrote: post #138

I was starting to get worried about the data collection already happening individually at these big companies. Now that they have announced a partnership which potentially combines all this data together, I feel so much better! The funny thing is, the companies are ALWAYS going to put a positive spin on this. Not very different from the WhatsApp "we won't show ads, ever" messaging. Now I am in the camp which says "Fo…

You just made me think about a few issues: 1. wouldn't these five be a cute quasi monopoly? (is pentapoly a word?) 2. isn't it brilliant how "they" - including many others, like Musk - make a big fuss about AI that is mostly already open and published, while what we should worry about is data? 3. is there any hope for an open society when most of us nerds - who are supposed to be all rebellious, undergroundy, securit…

The word you are referring to is oligarchy.

Re: Facebook, Amazon, Google, IBM and Microsoft Create Partnership on AI

#256

Post by edem »

HNridiculous wrote: post #163
thr0waway1239 wrote: post #138

I was starting to get worried about the data collection already happening individually at these big companies. Now that they have announced a partnership which potentially combines all this data together, I feel so much better! The funny thing is, the companies are ALWAYS going to put a positive spin on this. Not very different from the WhatsApp "we won't show ads, ever" messaging. Now I am in the camp which says "Fo…

This has nothing to do with data collection or any other crazy conspiracy theories you are trying to peddle such as Open AI being intentionally excluded etc. Hell half of your comment does not even makes any sense. Allowing OpenAI to do "Data audit" LOL are you seriously high on drugs. Do you know what OpenAI is or does?? Nothing with Auditing! And yet this is the most upvoted comment in this thread along with second…

Yet you didn't back your comment up with facts.

Re: Facebook, Amazon, Google, IBM and Microsoft Create Partnership on AI

#257

Post by edem »

xenobioticants wrote: post #84
j1vms wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Whether right or wrong, I think it's good to keep in mind that Apple has, by far the highest quarterly profit and total asset value, compared to any of these companies - it really is a giant among giants. Alphabet certainly has an excellent future outlook (reflected in the markets), but its current financial state still pales in comparison to Apple. Taking this into account, I figure Apple thinks twice and thrice bef…

'it really is a giant among giants.' You're confused. That would be Alphabet, not Apple. To put it in perspective for you, Google has: ~90% of the search market ( https://www.statista.com/statistics/216573/worldwide-market-... ) ~90% of the smartphone market ( https://techcrunch.com/2016/08/18/gartner-androids-smartphon... ) ~50% of the online advertisement market ( http://www.emarketer.com/Article/Google-Still-Domin…

You forgot to mention that without them 100% of the world won't be able to "google" anything.

Re: Facebook, Amazon, Google, IBM and Microsoft Create Partnership on AI

#258

Post by xg15 »

parasubvert wrote: post #210
xg15 wrote: post #204

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I just think it's rational that this should be decentralized, the risk of a company turning against "us" is a lot less than a government, given history. Last time I checked, Google search had 98% market share in Germany, Android had 78% market share worldwide. I don't see how you can talk about decentralisation given dominance like that. Whether or not a de-facto monopoly is a bad thing can be argued, I guess. (I per…

"Last time I checked, Google search had 98% market share in Germany, Android had 78% market share worldwide. I don't see how you can talk about decentralisation given dominance like that." They're not legislated as the Official Search Engine of the EU. Microsoft too once had 98% market share. As did IBM. Also, think of China, where Google has no market share. Baidu will grow and bide its time. "But if one is present,…

They're not legislated as the Official Search Engine of the EU. Microsoft too once had 98% market share. As did IBM.

And then what exactly happened? Did competitors beat them on their own market because of superior performance or better regards for the interests of users? Nope. They discovered new markets and solved new problems which made the old markets less relevant. It's not clear to me that this is a process that you can trust will work in the future.

* Personally, I'd rather not have an organization possibly run by Donald Trump know too much about me.*

You mean like Trump Ventures which owns stock of Google, Apple, AT&T, and Tesla (among many others)?

"Until facebook decides to shut down this api - which is at their sole discretion."

Unlikely, given that API is the only reason anyone pays them money.

That argument makes no sense. I as a user don't benefit at all if some analytics company has a contract with Facebook that allows them to access my data. If users should realistically be able to migrate to another service, they need free and automatic access to their data - which Facebook is in no way forced to provide.

Re: Facebook, Amazon, Google, IBM and Microsoft Create Partnership on AI

#259

Post by aub3bhat »

phodo wrote: post #249
aub3bhat wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I assumed that he was asserting it to be true, because as my updated comments shows, the metrics do exist. But Apple neither releases them nor does it discloses the architecture/technology (if any) used.

As others have mentioned, you are completely wrong in your assumptions. It is you who shows zero clue in reading comprehension and communication. I'm well aware of the benchmarks used by industry and academia. I've been working in the industry for many years, including multiple ML-based products used commercially and running in production serving a large number of customers. Machine translation was just an example, a…

LOL Dude its "popular press" for a reason, otherwise they would be called "technical journals".

And frankly how can you be so clueless about Apple's lack of efforts in AI/ML if you claim to be member of the community.

Re: Facebook, Amazon, Google, IBM and Microsoft Create Partnership on AI

#260

Post by aub3bhat »

throwanem wrote: post #199
aub3bhat wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Honestly this comment reads like an emotional outburst, by someone who has zero clue about the domain. Its very well known fact in AI/ML community, that Apple has almost little or no talent nor do they have any major efforts at organizational level (E.g. FAIR at FB, MSR, Brain & Deep Mind at Google). >> But in Machine Translation, Apple is ahead. LOL where did you get this from? I am pretty sure that Google NTM which…

I'm not sure that "Apple is behind" follows from "Apple doesn't publicize".

Following that line of reasoning lets just assume that Apple has solved Quantum Computers, Teleportation and Room temperature superconductors why stop at AI/ML
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