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Making Humans a Multiplanetary Species [video]

spacex.com

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Re: Making Humans a Multiplanetary Species [video]

#791

Post by im4w1l »

lisper wrote: post #496
mikeash wrote: post #148

Some of the comments here make me think of crabs in a pot pulling down the ones who try to climb out. Nobody's making you participate in this venture. If you don't like it, then you're free to go do whatever it is you do like. You might think Musk could better direct his efforts and resources elsewhere, but most other billionaires don't do anything all that interesting, they just invest their money in mundane stuff,…

> Some of the comments here make me think of crabs in a pot pulling down the ones who try to climb out. It's fine with me if some of my fellow crabs climb out, but it is very important not to lose sight of the fact (and to his credit, Musk gets this right) that unless all of us climb out (and we won't) then conditions in the pot are still going to matter to those -- almost certainly the vast majority -- who are left…

With a Martian colony, we could - if worst came to worst - start a zero-child policy, and "go silently into the night".

That would be unacceptable if it meant the end of humanity.

Re: Making Humans a Multiplanetary Species [video]

#792

Post by lmm »

mzw_mzw wrote: post #561
mintplant wrote: post #258

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Further, why so much focus on this particular billionaire, Personally, I'm worried by the fact that it's a billionaire driving this, nevermind which one in particular. If and when SpaceX colonizes Mars, what sort of life will the people up there live? Will it be a Musk dictatorship? A corporate fiefdom? Rich people remaking society in their own image wasn't exactly the space dream I grew up with.

There's a weird sort of fear of potential corporate dystopias that just ignores all the actual government dystopias that have existed throughout history. Plenty of government colonies were dictatorships, fiefdoms, attempts at building bizarre and broken societies. Many people reading this live in nations that originated in exactly that fashion.

There have pretty bad corporate dystopias in history too. The East India companies, Belgian Congo etc.

Many nations with dystopian origins are fine now, sure, but there was a lot of suffering along the way; I don't think it's unreasonable to want to prevent that.

Re: Making Humans a Multiplanetary Species [video]

#793

Post by icantdrive55 »

IndianAstronaut wrote: post #760
Florin_Andrei wrote: post #371

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Any time any single person does something positive, some armchair "expert" comes out the woodworks to tell you how it won't work or can't work. All public forums go bad once they reach a certain size. Since everything is on a gaussian curve (fat mediocre middle, and two asymptotes, one for greatness, the other for the opposite end), it's just pure statistics that junk comments will start creeping in once the popula…

This is what happened with Reddit. It used to be a lot more enlightened discussion and now it is a gutter of memes, paranoia, puns, and debased comments.

It's the puns. Some are funny, but it's just not funny anymore. I go on that site a few times a year, and the jokes never stop.

It's a pretty old website now. I thought the hilarious banter/play on words would have run its course. There must be some psychological thing going on?

I am reminded we are just monkeys, hitting buttons when I'm there. (No offence to monkeys. I like you guys. I think you're better than us.)

Some fads just take longer to run their course? Skinny jeans for men--done. Guys buying $500 tennis shoes--still going on. Guys that have the semi-Mohawk. Just enough on the sides to get a job--almost done. I can't think of anything that doesn't have a beginning, and end. All I can think of, right now, is life is too short. Depressing. This summer went by way to quick for myself. I wasted it.

Re: Making Humans a Multiplanetary Species [video]

#794

Post by lmm »

lazyjones wrote: post #551
AndrewKemendo wrote: post #203

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you don't like it, then you're free to go do whatever it is you do like. Right. And as what appears to be the loudest voice in this discussion, it's also my prerogative to advocate for what I believe to be a better allocation of resources. Lets not pretend there is not competition for attention, capital and enthusiasm for vision based projects. That I advocate for one over another - in competition - is exactly wha…

> it's also my prerogative to advocate for what I believe to be a better allocation of resources. Honest question, not trying to be rude: what makes you believe you have a better idea of what a good allocation of resources (and Elon Musk's / SpaceX's skills) would be? If you're so smart and good at allocating resources, what prevents you from pursuing that other project instead of demanding from other people to follo…

> Honest question, not trying to be rude: what makes you believe you have a better idea of what a good allocation of resources (and Elon Musk's / SpaceX's skills) would be?

We all advocate for what we believe, advance our best arguments, and collectively reach conclusions. That's how discussion is supposed to work, no? Or are we supposed to pick the smartest person in the room and then ignore everyone else?

Re: Making Humans a Multiplanetary Species [video]

#795

Post by lmm »

onewaystreet wrote: post #641
nixos wrote: post #534

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's human nature to attacks a reality-distortion field. If he would have said "You know guys. We're going to Mars. But right now, we're working on making rockets that go up, on time, in one piece. When we finish with that, we'll show how to go. It'll be hard. Here are the technical and sociological issues involved. When we're getting close to being ready to go, we'll get working on them."

But why do you care if Musk and SpaceX have a reality-distortion field? Worst case (or best case for you) is that he fails and you get to gloat.

Popular false beliefs always seem harmless until they suddenly aren't. The principle of explosion means that one false belief can justify literally any course of action, and by the time people start on a harmful course it's too late.

Re: Making Humans a Multiplanetary Species [video]

#796

Post by lmm »

BurningFrog wrote: post #423
lallysingh wrote: post #292

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Once you get there, what do you do? Just go back?

I assume different people do different things... Tourism would be an obvious sustainable Moon industry. That does fit your description :)

Will it really be sustainable? How many people will want to go twice?

Re: Making Humans a Multiplanetary Species [video]

#797

Post by bborud »

mikeash wrote: post #218
AndrewKemendo wrote: post #203

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you don't like it, then you're free to go do whatever it is you do like. Right. And as what appears to be the loudest voice in this discussion, it's also my prerogative to advocate for what I believe to be a better allocation of resources. Lets not pretend there is not competition for attention, capital and enthusiasm for vision based projects. That I advocate for one over another - in competition - is exactly wha…

You're free to advocate for other things, but most of the critics aren't doing this, they're just shitting all over this idea and then making vague waves in the general direction of other ideas. Further, why so much focus on this particular billionaire, who at least is focusing pretty hard on driving progress even if you don't agree on the precise direction, and ignoring all the ones just wasting it, or being activel…

The funny thing about Elon Musk is that he actually accomplishes stuff. Which is not the norm among vision-driven people.

I regularly get approached by vision-driven projects, to help them make something concrete, and the vast majority of them will accomplish nothing because the people on them are not doers and they don't understand practical matters. Many, many people do not understand the difference between dreaming and doing. And many people will happily waste their entire life dreaming about things and then getting bitter when someone else doesn't realize it for dem and give them the credit.

I'm not going to name names, but I had a discussion with a fairly known "visionary" who has been trying to claim credit for something which he did not do. Simply because he fucked around with an idea without actually making any progress on it for _decades_. All he did was to make it ever more complex and unattainable by adding useless shit to it. Then when someone actually managed to strip the idea down to something that could be realized he first shit all over it and then tried to claim credit for it once it became successful. Yet he wanted everyone to recognize him for his "contributions".

I generally don't give a shit about what people who do nothing think. To me, they do not count.

Elon Musk does stuff. His critics don't. Let's start there.

Re: Making Humans a Multiplanetary Species [video]

#798

Post by afsina »

mikeash wrote: post #148

Some of the comments here make me think of crabs in a pot pulling down the ones who try to climb out. Nobody's making you participate in this venture. If you don't like it, then you're free to go do whatever it is you do like. You might think Musk could better direct his efforts and resources elsewhere, but most other billionaires don't do anything all that interesting, they just invest their money in mundane stuff,…

To me, reason for this is that most of those HN posters are people with progressive-left tendencies. They will never like the idea that a capitalist will be the one doing this kind of job far better than the collective (state).
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