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Facebook Ordered to Stop Collecting Data on WhatsApp Users in Germany

nytimes.com

41–50 of 441 posts

Re: Facebook Ordered to Stop Collecting Data on WhatsApp Users in Germany

#41
post #23

I don't understand why the state has to become involved. Let the free market work and people decide for themselves. I stopped using WhatsApp the moment I read that facebook bought it.

> Let the free market work and people decide for themselves.

Free market has regulators. This IS the free market deciding.

Re: Facebook Ordered to Stop Collecting Data on WhatsApp Users in Germany

#42

Facebook asked WhatsApp users to give consent before collecting data, which some did. Why should the government intervine between consenting adults agreeing on a contract willfully? Isn't this the definition of tyranny and why we oppose things such as the war on drugs?

They did not. Opt-Out is not asking for consent. And even if you Opt-Out, WhatsApp will submit your data to facebook for analytic purposes.

The real problem here was quoted as "misdirection of the [whatsapp] users and the public" because WhatsApp stated that there wont be any data exchange between them and facebook, when they were accuired two years ago.

Re: Facebook Ordered to Stop Collecting Data on WhatsApp Users in Germany

#43

Facebook asked WhatsApp users to give consent before collecting data, which some did. Why should the government intervine between consenting adults agreeing on a contract willfully? Isn't this the definition of tyranny and why we oppose things such as the war on drugs?

Didn't they also say that you can't opt-out of analytics use?

Re: Facebook Ordered to Stop Collecting Data on WhatsApp Users in Germany

#44
post #31
post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Whatsapp gained massive users with their "no commercials ever" claim. They were a small independent company. And people arguably got invested in the network as a result. Now they reverse on that but the public feels locked in. I myself think... just switch to Signal or Telegram, but the amount of WA users is simply massive here in the EU. Everybody uses it.

Sometimes I wonder if the strategy of announcing "due to the anti commercial data privacy demands in Germany we are forced to suspend all German WA accounts for the next couple of days" is ever discussed at Facebook. I'd be interested to see the political pressure it would create. I think the network is strong enough that people won't switch to other apps instantly and there would be a pretty big "just gimme back my…

My understanding is that the German people generally are very wary of data being moved around and collected 'unnecessarily'. I think a ploy like this would only backfire on FB.

Re: Facebook Ordered to Stop Collecting Data on WhatsApp Users in Germany

#45
post #31
post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Whatsapp gained massive users with their "no commercials ever" claim. They were a small independent company. And people arguably got invested in the network as a result. Now they reverse on that but the public feels locked in. I myself think... just switch to Signal or Telegram, but the amount of WA users is simply massive here in the EU. Everybody uses it.

Sometimes I wonder if the strategy of announcing "due to the anti commercial data privacy demands in Germany we are forced to suspend all German WA accounts for the next couple of days" is ever discussed at Facebook. I'd be interested to see the political pressure it would create. I think the network is strong enough that people won't switch to other apps instantly and there would be a pretty big "just gimme back my…

I think people would switch pretty quickly. Most people will have friends locally and regionally - there will be some cut off internationally but they'd be the minority. And if everyone you know is prevented from using the same messaging service, the expedient solution is to change to a different one.

Re: Facebook Ordered to Stop Collecting Data on WhatsApp Users in Germany

#46
post #31
post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Whatsapp gained massive users with their "no commercials ever" claim. They were a small independent company. And people arguably got invested in the network as a result. Now they reverse on that but the public feels locked in. I myself think... just switch to Signal or Telegram, but the amount of WA users is simply massive here in the EU. Everybody uses it.

Sometimes I wonder if the strategy of announcing "due to the anti commercial data privacy demands in Germany we are forced to suspend all German WA accounts for the next couple of days" is ever discussed at Facebook. I'd be interested to see the political pressure it would create. I think the network is strong enough that people won't switch to other apps instantly and there would be a pretty big "just gimme back my…

I think also that it would backfire, if you look at what happened in Brazil [0], the blockade made Telegram very popular and again with what's happening here, they benefit [1].

[0] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10749129

[1] https://twitter.com/telegram

Re: Facebook Ordered to Stop Collecting Data on WhatsApp Users in Germany

#47

Facebook asked WhatsApp users to give consent before collecting data, which some did. Why should the government intervine between consenting adults agreeing on a contract willfully? Isn't this the definition of tyranny and why we oppose things such as the war on drugs?

Oh you fucking know that's a lie. They deliberately went out of their way to hide the 'choice'.

Re: Facebook Ordered to Stop Collecting Data on WhatsApp Users in Germany

#48
post #27
post #23

I don't understand why the state has to become involved. Let the free market work and people decide for themselves. I stopped using WhatsApp the moment I read that facebook bought it.

Privacy is strongly regulated in EU, there was a strong push for it from both our legislators and normal citizens. We asked the states to be involved and not let the "free market" decide by itself. In my state one of the most important and independent role in government is the "Privacy Regulator" which has the power to check, verify and impose strong regulations on how you manage others data, and is very active.

I'm sad to inform you, this is a horrible trap you and many Europeans fall into. All of this legislation comes from lobby groups representing the big telcos, who are just desperately looking for ways to keep the OTT's away. Just a couple of weeks ago a draft bill was published indicating that OTT's must be able to comply with the same regulations as a telco, which means, among things like "ability to call emergency services", that end-to-end encryption would NOT be allowed, because end-to-end encryption kills the capacity for "lawful interception". [1]

[1]: FT article, looks like it paywalled, link to google cache: "Brussels to tighten grip on web services in telecoms shake-up" https://goo.gl/MFYaIx

Re: Facebook Ordered to Stop Collecting Data on WhatsApp Users in Germany

#49

I would like to see a federal Staute inacted regarding the collection of user data in the US. Enacted quickly! Something on the lines of don't collect any data, besides name, password, email address. This information can never be sold. I have weird feeling, in the near future, we will find that information/data has been abused. No just abused by marketing/big data, etc.. And I'm not even arguing about the obvious--pe…

> I have a feeling, it will be the next big financial insider trading scandal. It will involve people we talk about here-- Google/Bing/FB insiders(the ones who can see individual IP's, and their data.), took all that information, and traded stock upon it. I have a similar prediction. There will come a time when companies with the USP of user data would be struggling to keep themselves afloat. What happens to user dat…

Thankfully companies under EU law won't be able to do that.

Re: Facebook Ordered to Stop Collecting Data on WhatsApp Users in Germany

#50
post #7

Now things are going to get interesting! I completely understand the desire for privacy but I think it's unrealistic to expect that Facebook won't consolidate its data by user across all their applications. Facebook (and Google, etc.) are now in the same business as the credit reporting agencies ... You are their only product. My hope is that the increasing outrage will drive users to one of the secure messaging appl…

Facebook are quite free to consolidate all user data in the EU. And then be bound by EU laws.

Which would of course limit what they can do with it. And I suspect it's commerical use, not consolidating, that Facebook are more concerned about. :)

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