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GIMP development - What’s the point?

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Re: GIMP development - What’s the point?

#141
post #55

Sorry to say I don't think GIMP is the best example of a great FLOSS project. Many other projects are very competitive (or better) than commercial options but GIMP is not even close. They just released support for 16bit/32bit/c color last year which is needed for so many scenarios. The unified transform tool mentioned as a highlight is really a pretty simple thing to code. They are 5-10 years behind what you get in P…

GIMP, Inkscape, Blender and other open source art production tools have a big chicken and egg problem. To really improve, they need more professionals using them and a part of them should be developers or willing to chip in by other means. But because there are issues (education included) that are deal breakers for pros, you can't expect it to get better quickly. The situation is much worse for art production tools (…

FreeCAD fits here as well, I suspect (is it even usable in its current state?).

Re: GIMP development - What’s the point?

#142
Hey, I'm C.Rogers, the original poster of this thankyou note that's got everyone bashing GIMP against Photoshop... which entirely misses the point of it. People seem hell-bent on comparing GIMP to Photoshop, saying they don't compare. Well, it's easy to say that isn't it? I came from 13+ years of Photoshop experience, with about 7 of those used in the professional world. I've since packed on another near decade using GIMP (at first in conjunction with Photoshop), I have since replaced Photoshop entirely in my professional work, and I use it every day. The biggest thing stopping professionals from using GIMP is the erroneous notion that it can't be used for the same professional tasks as Photoshop. I'm half tempted to start a YouTube channel called GIMP SUCKS, and fill it with screencaptures of my graphics work done entirely in GIMP. That's not just magazine adverts, that's billboards, that's convention booths, it's over 100 new products of my own design, and nearly 20,000 product photos. So please, if you have something specific to complain about, go post a bug report, or a wishlist item like a decent human being. Repeating over and over that GIMP can't replace Photoshop for professional work doesn't make it any more true. Here's some eye-candy for the nay-sayers: https://goo.gl/UwxEGp

Re: GIMP development - What’s the point?

#143

People whining about GIMP not being as good as PS don't appreciate what life was like on Linux before GIMP existed, or how primitive GIMP was when it first came out. GIMP has advanced leaps and bound over what it once was. I remember for ages PS fans were complaining about how GIMP had a multiple window layout, and how unnecessarily complex that was, and they wanted a single window layout. So the volunteers who work…

Indeed, it's literally 10 years younger than PS.

IMO it's the classic attitude of "everything should work because I don't care" as if code was writing itself.

Re: GIMP development - What’s the point?

#144

People whining about GIMP not being as good as PS don't appreciate what life was like on Linux before GIMP existed, or how primitive GIMP was when it first came out. GIMP has advanced leaps and bound over what it once was. I remember for ages PS fans were complaining about how GIMP had a multiple window layout, and how unnecessarily complex that was, and they wanted a single window layout. So the volunteers who work…

For professional use, how does modern GIMP compare to modern PS?

It's perfectly usable for professional work. There was a recent question on the GIMP developer thread asked by the head of a company to find out if GIMP was right for their graphics department. Their artists demanded a bunch of things that they were sure GIMP didn't have, or couldn't do. This was my response, having successfully replaced Photoshop with GIMP quite a few years ago:

3 Single row Marquee tool 4 Single coloumn marquee tool -Draw a rectangle selection across the canvas from end to end where you want the 1px selection. -In the rectangle select dialogue, scroll down to the "size" and enter "1" for the width or height

5 Polygonal lasso tool -The default mode for the lasso tool in GIMP is polygon. Click and drag for mouse mode. -Moreover notice you can move points you have already put down simply by dragging them where you want them (better than Photoshop in this way).

6 Magenetic lasso tool - Try the Scissors Select tool.

7 Quick Selection tool - Try the Foreground Selection Tool

11 Perspective crop tool - Select area to be cropped with lasso tool - Image > Crop to Selection - Use Perspective Tool to adjust

13 Color Sampler tool - Windows > Dockable Dialogues > Colors

14 Ruler tool - Try the Measure tool.

15 Spot healing brush tool - Try the Heal Tool.

13 Patch tool - Filters > Enhance > Heal Selection

14 Content aware move tool - make selection - Copy selection - Filters > Enhance > Heal Selection - Paste selection ... (I have no idea why you'd need a separate tool for this. ;P)

15 Red Eye tool - Filters > Enhance > Red Eye Removal

18 Color replacement tool - Use "Select by Color Tool" - Colors > Color Balance / Hue Saturation / Etc. - Additionally: Colors > Map > Color Exchange

19 Mixer Brush tool - GIMP will acquire brushes that include background color mixing in the 2.9/3.0 release - Check out Krita.org for an illustration program to rival Photoshop or Painter X

21 Pattern stamp tool - Select Clone tool - Scroll down in tool settings to "Source", and choose "pattern"

22 History Brush tool - Open another copy of your current working document from your last save point - select the Clone Tool - In your save point document, ctrl-click on the area to paint from - Switch back to your current document and paint as you like

23 Art History Brush tool - Not implemented, feel free. :) - Check out GMIC. It contains a wealth of interesting painting effects for GIMP.

25 Background eraser tool - Can be achieved with resynthesize as above, but if you must have it in an eraser tool form, feel free to implement.

26 Magic eraser tool - Fuzzy Select tool (Wand icon) - Layer > Mask > Add Layer Mask (check the "Selection" radio button and the "Invert Mask" checkbox and Click "Add")

32 Dodge tool 33 Burn tool - Try the Dodge/Burn Tool. ;P

34 Sponge tool - Try the Blur/Sharpen Tool

36 Free form pen tool - Try the Ink Tool

37 Add anchor point tool 38 Delete anchor point tool 39 Convert point tool

  - All Integrated into the Paths Tool.
  - Check out my 30 second runthrough of the Paths Tool and related functions: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3sgI8rCRLbQ
41 Vertical type tool 42 Horizontal type mask tool 43 Vertical type mask tool - Not implemented, these would be neat, but to be honest the Text tool needs a serious overhaul anyway. - Check out Inkscape.org for vertical text, and a much better and more versatile vector text system, and easy masks that don't need separate tools. Turn any text into a mask in two clicks.

44 Path selection tool 45 Direct Selection tool - Windows > Dockable Dialogues > Paths - Click on the first empty box beside your path to show it. It's now selectable with the Paths Tool.

46 Rectangle Tool - Feel free to impliment. This would be useful. - See Inkscape.org for a current solution that works great.

47 Rounded Rectangle tool - If you impliment this, please make it part of the rectangle tool. There is no point at all to having separate tools. :P - Inkscape.org again :) It's like Adobe Illustrator.

48 Ellipse tool - Feel free to impliment 49 Polygon tool - Paths tool already does this. I don't know why Adobe made a separate tool for this. It's unnecessary clutter. :)

50 Line tool - Paths tool... (hit b to end your line and start a new separate one)

51 Custom shape tool - Would be cool to see in GIMP - Check out the Polygon and Star Tool (Inkscape.org)

53 Rotate view tool - View > Rotate (also Ctrl + Shift + Middle Mouse Button)

58 Masking - Really? Gimp has more Masking options than the Carnival of Venice. ;P - Check out Quick Mask and Layer > Mask > Add Layer Mask - Also check out Mask to Selection, and Selction to Path.

59 Mode change in to CMYK - Feel free to try to impliment, but read this first: https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/CMYK_support_in_The_GIM... - Check out Scribus for conversion into CMYK (FOGRA 27 is the default, but you can add your own color profiles if that's not working for you)

Hope it helps. :)

-C

Re: GIMP development - What’s the point?

#145
post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For professional use, how does modern GIMP compare to modern PS?

It doesn't. GIMP's support for nondestructive editing is very primitive, which might be the biggest issue. In terms of tools PS is far more comprehensive and flexible. GIMP is more like Paint.NET than Photoshop.

How does lack of support for non-destructive editing make GIMP "more like Paint.NET"?

Re: GIMP development - What’s the point?

#146
post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You blame GIMP for not opening PSDs correctly, but note that it's not an open format and it's not a standard. GIMP developers can do nothing but try to reverse engineer support for it.

You can go through a convoluted process to get the documentation for the standard from Adobe (Someone where I used to work did this so we could add support for PSD to a game engine). I'll concede that that's unpalatable, and that it's probably something you need to do regularly as PSD does get updates. I'll also concede that its considerably easier to open a pdf for display vs for editing, and maybe all the info for…

"You can go through a convoluted process to get the documentation for the standard from Adobe"

I doesn't look complete to me (there's lots of things just marked 'obsolete' that, I guess, one will encounter in the wild, and things like "Macintosh printer record" that I fear you'll have to dig up tech notes from the '80s for), but it seems that has improved a bit, as there is information available for free at adobe.com now, whereas you needed to sign an NDA to get the SDK before: https://www.adobe.com/devnet-apps/photoshop/fileformatashtml... (via http://www.adobe.com/devnet/photoshop.html)

Re: GIMP development - What’s the point?

#147

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You had a SPARCStation 20 with Linux on it? Facepalm. The very first SPARCstation I bought also had Linux on it. I promptly ordered Solaris 7 from Sun for $50 (which is how much redhat CD's cost back then), played with Linux until my Solaris 7 kit arrived in the mail, completely wiped away Linux, installed Solaris 7, and never looked back. Seeing that UNIX System V Release 4.0 was such an awesome feeling. I was thril…

Solaris was definitely head and shoulders above Linux back in the early days. But, in retrospect, it might have been a very good move to use Linux and get familiar with it, and especially to contribute to its development, as Linux turned out to be the future (thought not so much on Sun hardware).

But, in retrospect, it might have been a very good move to use Linux and get familiar with it, and especially to contribute to its development,

Linux might be all the rage now, but it won't last forever. I grew to intensely hate GNU/Linux precisely because I grew up on Solaris, and when I had to work on Linux extensively, it just made it painfully obvious how bad Linux is. Even to this present day, I work with Linux daily and it still isn't anywhere close to Solaris in terms of correctness of operation, reliability, or virtualization capability, let alone post mortem analysis. Even performance on Linux is a lie, as to get the same levels of performance as illumos does on the same hardware, Linux has to forego reliability guarantees. For example, check out how the GNU/Linux kernel handles the fsync(2) system call, and how it miscalculates system load because of wio (wait on input/output). And that is just the tip of the iceberg. I haven't even begun to scratch the surface.

I was very happy and content with Solaris - it is a superb server OS, it is reliable, and it has served me extremely well, especially since I had virtually no incidents caused by the fault in the OS, but by misconfiguration by others. Under these circumstances, I had no incentive whatsoever to help with GNU/Linux, especially when Solaris became the free, open source illumos project. I certainly won't help Linux when I want SmartOS to succeed it (SmartOS is based on the illumos source code).

But the biggest irony is that GNU/Linux can be made to run almost as reliably as Solaris / illumos - by running it inside of an lx-branded zone on SmartOS, because then the SmartOS hypervisor makes it more reliable because of ZFS and no memory overcommit, for instance. That's what one would call a proverbial slap in the face to GNU/Linux. (Even though one is running Linux, the kernel is actually illumos, that's why the thing is high performance and reliable.)

Re: GIMP development - What’s the point?

#148
post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When you have to print thousands of leaflets for a client using that client's corporate colors and, after printing, it turns out that the artwork was in RGB and the colors are not exactly those the client wanted[0], yes, you notice it. And the client always gives a crap. Of course no one cares if you print something for your house or a friend and the color is slightly off. But in some industries something like that c…

Even so, doesn't this just boil down to a few math functions applied to each pixel? Why would I need something in GIMP whose effect can only be seen on paper, except as some kind of Export ... format? Suppose I have a properly calibrated monitor, yadda yadda, I should be seeing good colors on the screen as I'm editing. When I'm done, good colors on paper can only be seen after the data passes through a professional p…

It's not so simple.

The problem: https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/1/1e/CIE1931x...

Colors in one colorspace may not have a representation in another. If you do all your editing in RGB and then try and convert at the end, you restrict yourself to the set of colors available in both. To get print colors that are accurate to a provided spec, you need to work in the target colorspace directly, with an editor that will approximate the colors on your sRGB monitor as best it can so you can see what you're doing.

Re: GIMP development - What’s the point?

#149

I haven't used a direct image editor in a very long time and I don't think I'm missing anything. Digital Fusion is free. Houdini Indie is $200. Nuke is available for linux. These are all node based work flows that don't destroy anything. You don't have to undo because you create a graph of operations without changing your source directly. They aren't useful for painting directly with a tablet, but anything else they…

Did you mean Design Fusion, from Blackmagic?

It used to be Digital Fusion before Blackmagic bought it.
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