Nootropics • Hacker News Board

Re: Nootropics

#341

Post by taternuts » Wed, Sep 21, 2016, 5:28 PM UTC

throwaway__123 wrote: post #117

Zoloft I am afraid of sounding like a shill, but the fact is I'm 30 engineer, who has been trying to feel better my whole life through experiments with: ketamine, CBD, various nutrients, various dietary changes, exercise, being more social, meditation. None of them made lasting improvement like sertraline has, I wish I had been open-minded enough to try it years ago. In retrospect, maybe it was ridiculous to try to f…

I'd be careful recommending any specific anti-depressant. The overall advice to seek a doctor about depression is solid though, as the right medication can literally be life saving. The thing with anti-depressants is you kind of need to experiment at first to find the one that works best for your body and mind. There are some types that will either not work at all, or even make you feel significantly worse - this doesn't mean it's not still the right avenue to pursue, you just need to find the medication that's effective for you. There's really no transient high that is going to change your overall mood and pull you out of depression. It's a topical cure for a systemic issue, but it sure can be fun.

Re: Nootropics

#342

Post by Swizec » Wed, Sep 21, 2016, 5:30 PM UTC

greenshackle wrote: post #332

Swizec wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To add to this: find a sport you enjoy and keep doing it. Don't be afraid to test and iterate. And remember, if it took you 20 years of practice to become a hardened couch potato, don't expect to change overnight.

I get utterly bored with new sports within 3-6 months. This has happened with every sport I have tried, no matter how much I loved it at the beginning. Some people enjoy repetition. Some... really don't. For me the challenge is to keep finding new interesting sports.

Hey whatever works :)

I've been boxing almost every day for almost 6 years now. The more into it I get, the more there is to discover and the tougher my sparring partners get. It really doesn't feel like repetition at all.

So maybe you just haven't found a sport you liked yet. Or haven't given them enough time to reach a level of mastery where it doesn't feel so repetitive anymore.

Re: Nootropics

#343

Post by metaphorm » Wed, Sep 21, 2016, 5:31 PM UTC

scriptkiddy wrote: post #326

Practicality wrote: post #272

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am a little ambivalent about that. How about coffee, vitamin d, calcium and tyrosine? All of them have proven benefits, nothing fringe: http://www.informationisbeautiful.net/visualizations/snake-o... That combined with exercise, sleep and eating well is pretty much my "stack." Personally I would rather not risk the possibility of destroying my brain with something unproven. However, for things with proven benefits…

Caffeine, calcium, and Tyrosine can all be found in normal food and beverages. There's no need to supplement them unless you have a terrible diet. You can get vitamin d by going outside every once in a while.

what "normal" food contains caffeine? brewed coffee is a drug preparation. the trace quantities of it you find in things like chocolate are largely below the level of being noticeable or effectual. chocolate itself is essentially a drug preparation also. you aren't eating chocolate purely for nourishment. you eat it because it makes you feel good.

so I ask again, what is "normal" food? where do you get your ideas of normal from?

Re: Nootropics

#344

Post by greenshackle » Wed, Sep 21, 2016, 5:31 PM UTC

hasbroslasher wrote: post #123

So you're telling me you alter your biochemistry to become more productive without a care for how it affects your overall (mostly mental) health? Hell, I started smoking cigarettes at 16, which I rank near the top of my worst decisions ever, despite the fact that it helped me hack my brain chemistry as I powered through numerous difficult math and CS classes with top scores. As a result, I spent years thrashing, kick…

> So you're telling me you alter your biochemistry to become more productive without a care for how it affects your overall (mostly mental) health?

Uh? Did you read Gwern? This is literally the opposite of what he does. He is ALL ABOUT weighing risks to overall health. Did you miss the fact that half of his articles detail the potential bad effects of the drugs he's trying?

>Hell, I started smoking cigarettes at 16, which I rank near the top of my worst decisions ever, despite the fact that it helped me hack my brain chemistry

He has an article on non-tobacco nicotine (nicotine gum, patches). His conclusions are, IIRC, 'kinda useful, but has some risks'. He doesn't have a page on cigarettes. You know why? Because cigarettes are THE WORSE. Everyone knows this. It's silly to write off all performance enhancing drugs on the grounds that you once made the bad decision to use possibly the very worse one, from a risk/benefit perspective."

I grant you that brain chemistry hacking may be one step towards em-world, which is as Moloch as it gets, but if you're working on important problems it the edge may be worth it.

Re: Nootropics

#345

Post by hasbroslasher » Wed, Sep 21, 2016, 5:38 PM UTC

orangecat wrote: post #255

hasbroslasher wrote: post #123

So you're telling me you alter your biochemistry to become more productive without a care for how it affects your overall (mostly mental) health? Hell, I started smoking cigarettes at 16, which I rank near the top of my worst decisions ever, despite the fact that it helped me hack my brain chemistry as I powered through numerous difficult math and CS classes with top scores. As a result, I spent years thrashing, kick…

To me, the entire idea of performance-enhancing chemicals is the essence of Moloch Moloch specifically refers to zero-sum games. Intelligence enhancement is not that; if everyone in the world gained 10 IQ points we would almost certainly be far better off. To what ends? Curing cancer and Alzheimer's, getting self-driving cars on the road by 2025 instead of 2030, colonizing Mars, figuring out how to fix our diets with…

I pointed this out in another comment - most work actually carries negative externalities and side effects that you're not accounting for. Disagree on Moloch, I defer to the fish pond example. It's not zero-sum, it's negative sum (everyone ends up worse off).

Ever met someone who has burned out? It's not pretty. Did you know that work-related-stress is amongst the largest threats to (particularly men's) health? Have you seen workaholism, stress-induced alcoholism, general-burnt-out-ness ruin relationships? What makes you think nootropics won't cause these problems as well? After all, ex nihilo nihil fit.

Ever think about how much gas you burn getting to work, how much plastic trash you create at lunch or coffee, how much coal it takes to keep the lights and the AC on for you to do what you do? Ever think about how many people died of weird lung diseases to produce that coal? Again, nothing comes from nothing.

Unless your work really is curing cancer, de-acidifying the oceans, or colonizing Mars, it's likely that your work is actually a negative sum game. You're worse off for it, and so is everyone else.

Re: Nootropics

#346

Post by hasbroslasher » Wed, Sep 21, 2016, 5:41 PM UTC

princeb wrote: post #204

hasbroslasher wrote: post #123

So you're telling me you alter your biochemistry to become more productive without a care for how it affects your overall (mostly mental) health? Hell, I started smoking cigarettes at 16, which I rank near the top of my worst decisions ever, despite the fact that it helped me hack my brain chemistry as I powered through numerous difficult math and CS classes with top scores. As a result, I spent years thrashing, kick…

> that many people (men, in particular) say their greatest regret was working so hard i think many people also regret not working harder.

It's great you think that, but the data I've seen nearly always says the opposite.

Re: Nootropics

#347

Post by theonething » Wed, Sep 21, 2016, 5:45 PM UTC

mettamage wrote: post #94

HalfwayToDice wrote: post #74

The best nootropic is getting a good nights sleep. It takes effort! Preparing for bed early and disciplining yourself to put the light out is not easy. Not nearly as easy as popping a pill. But it's so much more effective than any drug listed here. And for a safe and provable quick cognitive boost, take some caffeine, preferable green tea with theanine.

It's hard for me to fall asleep. I haven't cracked it yet how to do it perfectly. What helps: view the problem as improving your likelihood to sleep. Before I viewed the problem as falling asleep 100% of the time, which is a really defeating view to have when I can't fall asleep. Sleep tips that help me: 1. meditation: still experimenting with body-scan vs. breath meditation, they both help but have different effects…

I've tried lots of different things and the most effective has been forcing myself to get up early (~6am for me). It was really difficult when I first started, but then I got into a routine. It's the only thing that consistently causes me to be feel tired earlier at night and be able to fall asleep more easily. I also combine that with reading in bed (with a orange filtered light bulb) until I nod off (~20 minutes).

Sometimes getting up so early makes me tired during the day (I'm not a natural morning person) so I'll take micro naps to mitigate.

And getting an early start to my day is fantastic. I can run, read, meditate, etc before I start my work day.

Re: Nootropics

#348

Post by hasbroslasher » Wed, Sep 21, 2016, 5:45 PM UTC

greenshackle wrote: post #344

hasbroslasher wrote: post #123

So you're telling me you alter your biochemistry to become more productive without a care for how it affects your overall (mostly mental) health? Hell, I started smoking cigarettes at 16, which I rank near the top of my worst decisions ever, despite the fact that it helped me hack my brain chemistry as I powered through numerous difficult math and CS classes with top scores. As a result, I spent years thrashing, kick…

> So you're telling me you alter your biochemistry to become more productive without a care for how it affects your overall (mostly mental) health? Uh? Did you read Gwern? This is literally the opposite of what he does. He is ALL ABOUT weighing risks to overall health. Did you miss the fact that half of his articles detail the potential bad effects of the drugs he's trying? >Hell, I started smoking cigarettes at 16,…

Fair point. My point wasn't "hur hur cigs are bad ergo caffeine is bad" - rather that there are costs and benefits to everything (adderall, cigs, coffee, probably this modafinil shit) and that I don't think the benefits to being able to work around the close really exceed the costs, especially on a personal level. Like I said, becoming a diarrhea-ridden coffee maniac isn't a great fate either, especially when a good night of sleep solves the same problem.

It sounds like we agree there.

Re: Nootropics

#349

Post by forloop » Wed, Sep 21, 2016, 5:48 PM UTC

scriptkiddy wrote: post #313

aninhumer wrote: post #289

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think this interpretation is improbable, otherwise I wouldn't be suggesting it. And my points have not changed, all I've done is clarify them.

I'm pretty sure the person you were arguing with is trolling. There's no way someone could be so socially inept to take the op's point so literally.

The best thing about code is you don't have to convince idiots that you're correct.

Investing has the same property.

What if I'm not a troll? Then I guess that would make you inept!

Re: Nootropics

#350

Post by Raphmedia » Wed, Sep 21, 2016, 5:58 PM UTC

mrfusion wrote: post #314

Raphmedia wrote: post #281

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> magnesium Yes! Magnesium changed my life! I was certain that I was living with a hard depression... until I read somewhere that lactose intolerance can lead to magnesium deficiency. I started taking Magnesium and felt the effect immediately. All of my body is physically relaxed. I struggled with muscle cramps and spasms, they are gone thanks to increasing my magnesium intake. The body truly is a machine... !

Can you share the brand and dosage?

I use "Nature's Bounty Magnesium Mineral Supplement", the 500mg ones.

At first I selected wrong product at the store and purchased homeopathy magnesium supplements. Suffice to says that those didn't work.