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Nootropics

gwern.net

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Re: Nootropics

#11

Post by striking »

Herodotus38 wrote: post #4

I stopped reading after the grammar of the first two sentences. I cannot parse the second sentence, although I think I get what they are trying to say. Fair or not, I interpret this as a public service announcement against nootropics.

It's no more dense or abstruse than the introductory philosophy text I've started reading. Yeah, it might take you a try or two to understand what they're saying, but that in and of itself isn't a very strong case against the article.

In fact, the writer actually agrees with you, in a sense, in that second sentence. He mentions that the piece is strictly anecdotal and should be taken with a grain of salt, and that you shouldn't burn too much time on this stuff because there are limits to what you can achieve.

Maybe you should give the article another go. You might learn something new, or at least have wasted your time in an engaging way.

Re: Nootropics

#12

Post by panzagl »

psyc wrote: post #9
oh_sigh wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Care to try to parse those sentences for us, so we can determine if it is the reader or the writer with the grammar problem.

The problem is very long run-on sentences, with parentheticals, and awkward word omissions.

Seems like he's trying for that overly formal 18th/19th century style of scientific writing.

Re: Nootropics

#13

Post by empath75 »

Not to generalize but this totally looks like something someone hopped up on amphetamines would write. Get to the point, man.

Re: Nootropics

#14

Post by throwaway123912 »

elevensies wrote: post #3

Melatonin has made it possible for me to sleep much more consistently which has been a huge help, since I saw Gwern's post on it a while ago.

Melatonin has worked wonders for me as well. However it's worth mentioning that the 3mg capsules I bought are WAAAY too strong and cause me to wake up with a dry mouth and a headache after a couple of hours of intense dreaming and nightmares. Instead now I split the caps open and take a tiny fraction of the melatonin every night. It takes me a few weeks to go through a single capsule.

Re: Nootropics

#15

Post by blhack »

elevensies wrote: post #3

Melatonin has made it possible for me to sleep much more consistently which has been a huge help, since I saw Gwern's post on it a while ago.

You should switch to valerian root if you can. It isn't habit forming in the way that melatonin is.

edit: since everybody is asking the same question about habit forming. I am just passing on the information that I got from my doctor. She made this suggestion to me, and it was beneficial to me. Once I had started using melatonin, I would have trouble falling asleep without it. Valarian root didn't cause that issue for me.

Re: Nootropics

#16

Post by cavisne »

Its concerning to see Modafinil on the same list of "defaults" as caffeine and vitamin D. They are on a different scale when it comes to the effect on your brain.

That aside, my anecdotal experience of mod is its basically a waste of time. Sure you stay awake longer but we can all easily procrastinate a day away regardless, it wont make you any more focused or any smarter. If you for some reason need to improve your focus for a period then dexamphetamines are the way to go, of course you should not pop them every day.

Re: Nootropics

#17

Post by wutbrodo »

tonyhb wrote: post #10
gregrata wrote: post #7

A summary would be awesome - I appreciate the amount of work and details that went into this, but a list of what worked and didn't would be a great start - interested readers could then dive into details

Reddit actually has an active nootropics community with a wiki for beginners: https://www.reddit.com/r/nootropics/wiki/beginners . The standard stuff is L-Theanine + Caffeine. For cognitive enhancement any of the "racetams" are considered proven, and you branch out into untested army drugs when you take modafinil. I've tried each of these and stick with L-Theanine and Caffeine daily. Piracetam had no visible effect o…

> you branch out into untested army drugs when you take modafinil.

What on earth are you talking about? Modafinil is very much _not_ an "untested army drug". It's pretty well-studied, approved for use by the FDA, and available for sale (with prescription) under multiple names in the US, and by prescription with no other legal restrictions in most other countries. It has a freaking WebMD page[1]!

[1] http://www.webmd.com/drugs/2/drug-16964/provigil-oral/detail...

Re: Nootropics

#18

Post by nefitty »

tonyhb wrote: post #10
gregrata wrote: post #7

A summary would be awesome - I appreciate the amount of work and details that went into this, but a list of what worked and didn't would be a great start - interested readers could then dive into details

Reddit actually has an active nootropics community with a wiki for beginners: https://www.reddit.com/r/nootropics/wiki/beginners . The standard stuff is L-Theanine + Caffeine. For cognitive enhancement any of the "racetams" are considered proven, and you branch out into untested army drugs when you take modafinil. I've tried each of these and stick with L-Theanine and Caffeine daily. Piracetam had no visible effect o…

In regards to modafinil, it is a schedule IV drug in the US. It's a bit difficult to get and quite expensive. I've done well with adrafinil, which is a prodrug of moda and relatively easy to get.

Re: Nootropics

#19

Post by blazespin »

Pretty impressive work. I personally use nicotine gum (as does President Obama, a health nut) as I'm allergic to caffeine. I have used melatonin in the past, though given this I will use it more now.

The key I find is to only use them when you have already outlined in a detailed way a significant set of tasks that need to be performed or a particularly critical meeting where you already have a very strong background.

For learning, general creative process I don't use them.

The biggest problem is managing the physical addiction (ie, you feel very tired) when you're not taking them.

Also there is some evidence that nicotine increases incidence of cancer. Not to mention what it does to my blood pressure, though I find constant exercise helps manage that.

Re: Nootropics

#20

Post by tonyhb »

wutbrodo wrote: post #17
tonyhb wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Reddit actually has an active nootropics community with a wiki for beginners: https://www.reddit.com/r/nootropics/wiki/beginners . The standard stuff is L-Theanine + Caffeine. For cognitive enhancement any of the "racetams" are considered proven, and you branch out into untested army drugs when you take modafinil. I've tried each of these and stick with L-Theanine and Caffeine daily. Piracetam had no visible effect o…

> you branch out into untested army drugs when you take modafinil. What on earth are you talking about? Modafinil is very much _not_ an "untested army drug". It's pretty well-studied, approved for use by the FDA, and available for sale (with prescription) under multiple names in the US, and by prescription with no other legal restrictions in most other countries. It has a freaking WebMD page[1]! [1] http://www.webmd.…

I totally thought it was untested back when I did it, though that was 6 years ago. And one of the few things I read about it in terms of studies was its effects on army pilots during 12+ hour training sessions here: http://www.dtic.mil/cgi-bin/GetTRDoc?AD=ADA533725, hence why I thought it was an army drug.

Learned something new today.

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