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Apple Slaps Developers In The Face

theflashblog.com

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Re: Apple Slaps Developers In The Face

#81

Post by Psyonic »

gamache wrote: post #44
jherdman wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, that's sort of what I'm driving at. Apple clearly has an agenda with this clause and its not 100% clear to the developer community what that agenda is. Do they mean things like PhoneGap are dead, or simply things that provide an alternative API (e.g. running apps via the Adobe Air runtimes). How about cross compilers? Does Apple really give a damn if you write something in Scheme and then have it transcoded int…

My point is that their agenda, while useful to know, mean nothing in the long run, because as long as that clause is active, Apple has the ability to enforce it capriciously. Whether or not they "mean" things like PhoneGap are dead, etc., is irrelevant. The ability to kill any app because of its original source language is the important thing.

You do realize that "ability" was already there? They've always had full control of what they allow in the store, so this latest change is only significant in intent, not ability.

Re: Apple Slaps Developers In The Face

#82

Post by rbanffy »

rbanffy wrote: post #75
mdasen wrote: post #25

So, there are a couple things here that jump to my mind. 1. Adobe isn't completely innocent. They're pretty close to a monopoly on their type of software and charge dearly for it (their Creative Suite costs as much as a MacBook Pro). They've done a lot to make sure there are no non-Adobe Flash players even when that's just hurting customers and not costing them money since they don't sell the player. They're not exac…

> It brings developers to the Mac by forcing them to buy one No. Thanks. I have no urge to develop for iPhone, iPod or iPad, much less in Objective C. I think I am gonna pass this one. ;-)

I will assume the down-voter thinks Apple is forcing him to buy a Mac.

If you want a Mac, go buy one. You don't need Apple as an excuse. They are very good computers, very well built and have an OS that, IMHO, is second only to a decent Linux box as a development platform.

It's so good it breaks my heart to install Linux on top of it. So much in fact I never did it.

Except once, when I installed MkLinux on a Power 9500. Very nice X terminal, BTW.

Re: Apple Slaps Developers In The Face

#83

Post by Psyonic »

jongraehl wrote: post #50

There probably isn't anything Apple can do to prevent people implementing cross compilers from i{pad,phone}-legal code to other platforms. So this is merely offensive and insulting to programmers, and can't create any lasting competitive advantage.

Sure there is. I'm not saying they'd go there, but they could make a blanket statement that all i{pad,phone} apps be exclusives, and if they see the app appear in another mobile store, it's gone. Again, I'm not saying they'd go there, but they certainly could.

Re: Apple Slaps Developers In The Face

#84

Post by Raphael_Amiard »

0x44 wrote: post #79
Raphael_Amiard wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>1. Adobe isn't completely innocent. Who cares about a company being "innocent" ? What does that even mean ? >(their Creative Suite costs as much as a MacBook Pro) Do you have a serious study saying that Creative Suite is overpriced ? Because it doesn't look that way to me. And what does that even have to do with anything ? >I'm sure they don't want to deal with developers using up their support time over things that…

People have invested time and money in this platform, and yet Apple decides to change the terms of the game and screw them over completely. Investing in a platform does not guarantee you'll profit from your investment, nor does it oblige the provider to continue providing you the means to recoup your investment.

The fact that they have the right to do it doesn't make it right.

What in this sentence do you not understand ?

Also, Apple relies on developers to make some of their profit. Even if it's a relatively small profit, screwing theirs openly doesn't look like a very clever business practice to me.

Re: Apple Slaps Developers In The Face

#85

Post by furyg3 »

jluxenberg wrote: post #15

[Sentence regarding Apple's intentions redacted at request from Adobe] did anyone read this before the post was edited?

I find it slightly amusing that these two statements are in adjoining paragraphs:

The trouble is that we will never hear their discontent because Apple employees are forbidden from blogging, posting to social networks, or other things that we at companies with an open culture take for granted

[Sentence regarding Apple's intentions redacted at request from Adobe].

Re: Apple Slaps Developers In The Face

#86

Post by steveklabnik »

rbanffy wrote: post #82
rbanffy wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It brings developers to the Mac by forcing them to buy one No. Thanks. I have no urge to develop for iPhone, iPod or iPad, much less in Objective C. I think I am gonna pass this one. ;-)

I will assume the down-voter thinks Apple is forcing him to buy a Mac. If you want a Mac, go buy one. You don't need Apple as an excuse. They are very good computers, very well built and have an OS that, IMHO, is second only to a decent Linux box as a development platform. It's so good it breaks my heart to install Linux on top of it. So much in fact I never did it. Except once, when I installed MkLinux on a Power 95…

Nope, you're getting downvoted because your comment doesn't actually add anything to the discussion. Snarky replies aren't (generally) considered valuable here.

Re: Apple Slaps Developers In The Face

#87

Post by anon95110 »

sheesh... while one half of Adobe's brain (the flash-obsessed Macromedia one) is still screaming and flinging mud, the other half already used some of the perfectly Apple-endorsed C/C++ code they've got lying around and build a useful iPad App: http://itunes.apple.com/us/app/adobe-ideas-1-0-for-ipad/id36... - It's not like they're all about Flash; although it's obviously this guy's job to make it look like it - hence the title of evangelist.

Re: Apple Slaps Developers In The Face

#88

Post by ecq »

Apple's prohibition of Flash-built apps in iPhone 4.0 related to multitasking

http://www.appleinsider.com/articles/10/04/09/apples_prohibi...

from the article:

"if Apple were simply trying to block Adobe from cross-compiling Flash to create iPhone apps, it could have added the changed text to its existing license agreement and spoiled Adobe's CS5 party immediately, rather than just threatening change that appears fated to kick in when Apple delivers iPhone 4.0 in June.

The primary reason for the change, say sources familiar with Apple's plans, is to support sophisticated new multitasking APIs in iPhone 4.0. The system will now be evaluating apps as they run in order to implement smart multitasking. It can't do this if apps are running within a runtime or are cross compiled with a foreign structure that doesn't behave identically to a native C/C++/Obj-C app.

"[The operating system] can't swap out resources, it can't pause some threads while allowing others to run, it can't selectively notify, etc. Apple needs full access to a properly-compiled app to do the pull off the tricks they are with this new OS," wrote one reader under the name Ktappe."

Re: Apple Slaps Developers In The Face

#89

Post by barrkel »

abstractbill wrote: post #39
mdasen wrote: post #25

So, there are a couple things here that jump to my mind. 1. Adobe isn't completely innocent. They're pretty close to a monopoly on their type of software and charge dearly for it (their Creative Suite costs as much as a MacBook Pro). They've done a lot to make sure there are no non-Adobe Flash players even when that's just hurting customers and not costing them money since they don't sell the player. They're not exac…

It's also in Apple's interest to get people using Objective-C and their toolkit. It brings developers to the Mac by forcing them to buy one. I'm not convinced Apple is trying to force developers to buy Macs, and I'm far from convinced that such a strategy would actually work.

I bought a Mac Mini with my iPod touch solely so that I could potentially write applications for it.

I never did get around to it - my girlfriend went farther than I did - and so it sits, gathering dust, under my desk.

But if I had a toolkit that let me develop iPhone apps without having to buy a Mac Mini, then I'd be much more likely to develop an iPhone app.

So take me as a data point: the existing practical restrictions forced me to buy a Mac.

Re: Apple Slaps Developers In The Face

#90

Post by fierarul »

allyt wrote: post #69
gamache wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We have something official, more official than any press release: the developer contract. No matter what Apple says in the next few days, nothing short of removing the new clause can prevent Apple from enforcing it at will.

We have something official, more official than any press release: the developer contract We have Gruber's interpretation of a complex legal document, taken completely out of the context in which "Application" is defined. Lawyers don't get paid big bucks to interpret this stuff for nothing.

They get paid to try and convince a judge or jury that their client's interpretation of the document is the correct one. You think it's a mistake the text is a bit vague and not everything properly defined ?

Legal texts aren't software; it's actually in the best interest of Apple to define things as broad and vaguely as possible so they cover a large spectrum.

I think Gruber's interpretation is one that any person reading the document will have.

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