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Steve Jobs Has Just Gone Mad

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Re: Steve Jobs Has Just Gone Mad

#21

Post by danparsonson »

The key is where they say "Applications must be originally written in Objective-C, C, C++."

Take a pause and think about what that "originally" really means.

Developers are not free to use any tools to help them. If there is some tool that converts some Pascal or, Ruby, or Java into Objective-C it is out of bounds, because then the code is not "originally" written in C.

Yes it is "originally" written in C - when the Objective-C compiler first sees it. There's nothing in the quoted clause from the Apple T&Cs that says "written == written by a human".

I really don't think this clause is aimed at code converters, but rather at e.g. run-times that execute byte code - see also "(e.g., Applications that link to Documented APIs through an intermediary translation or compatibility layer or tool are prohibited)". You don't link to an API until either compile- or run-time. Making an API call from a piece of code that is then converted into C is not 'linking to APIs through an intermediary layer'.

OK, it still sucks, but it seems to me that both this article and the other similar one on here at the moment ("Apple takes stance on consciousness", http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1252438) are based largely on a misinterpretation of the use of the word 'originally'.

Re: Steve Jobs Has Just Gone Mad

#22

Post by orangecat »

tptacek wrote: post #18
peterarmstrong wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That doesn't make it anything short of disgusting -- it's worse than anything MS ever did.

REALLY. Saying "no alternate compilers on our hardware" is worse than using the threat of yanking OEM licenses for the then-monopoly desktop OS if they dared to feature another company's browser on the desktop?

Arguably yes. Microsoft never tried to stop users from running whatever software they wanted on Windows, they just made it more inconvenient in some cases to get that software.

Re: Steve Jobs Has Just Gone Mad

#23

Post by CamperBob »

tptacek wrote: post #18
peterarmstrong wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That doesn't make it anything short of disgusting -- it's worse than anything MS ever did.

REALLY. Saying "no alternate compilers on our hardware" is worse than using the threat of yanking OEM licenses for the then-monopoly desktop OS if they dared to feature another company's browser on the desktop?

Yes, it is. My in-house process is none of Apple's (or Microsoft's) business.

Re: Steve Jobs Has Just Gone Mad

#24

Post by jrockway »

sant0sk1 wrote: post #19
nick-dap wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"merely (!) trying to control what tools people use to create software on their platform" Put any OS of your choice, except iPhone, in that sentence and it sounds pretty darn insane to me.

Don't game consoles have expensive, compulsory SDKs?

Yeah, and that's why your console spends 90% of its life powered off.

Re: Steve Jobs Has Just Gone Mad

#25

Post by rubinelli »

charlesju wrote: post #6

I really doubt that this particular rule is aimed at the masses. Steve Jobs could care less about things like PhoneGap and random IDEs. In my opinion this is a strategic method to create optionality in case it needs to go into outright war against Adobe.

Of course, we know who this new rule is aimed at, but nevertheless, several interesting projects will go down as collateral damage. Even if the App Store doesn't enforce this at first, would you spend time and money developing your app in an unsanctioned tool, knowing that it can be pulled off the store at any moment? I would be specially angry if I were one of the Appcelerator guys. They rewrote Titanium for iPhone so instead of using JavaScript on top of WebKit, it used the SDK to create snappy, fully native apps. ( http://techzinglive.com/?p=177 ) Now they will have to go back to the original plan, with an inferior product, or give up on the iPhone entirely.

Re: Steve Jobs Has Just Gone Mad

#26

Post by [deleted] »

stcredzero wrote: post #8

Summary: If you need to "originally" write your code in Swahili, while listening to Milli Vanilli, while reclining in a patch of mud, and then you need fifty oompa loompas to translate the Swahili into C, that is none of Steve Jobs f#ck^ng business.

[deleted]

Re: Steve Jobs Has Just Gone Mad

#27

Post by CamperBob »

sant0sk1 wrote: post #19
nick-dap wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"merely (!) trying to control what tools people use to create software on their platform" Put any OS of your choice, except iPhone, in that sentence and it sounds pretty darn insane to me.

Don't game consoles have expensive, compulsory SDKs?

Yes, and none of them have ever included a rule against cross-compiled code, to the best of my knowledge.

Re: Steve Jobs Has Just Gone Mad

#28

Post by tptacek »

orangecat wrote: post #22
tptacek wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

REALLY. Saying "no alternate compilers on our hardware" is worse than using the threat of yanking OEM licenses for the then-monopoly desktop OS if they dared to feature another company's browser on the desktop?

Arguably yes. Microsoft never tried to stop users from running whatever software they wanted on Windows, they just made it more inconvenient in some cases to get that software.

"I will use my operating system monopoly to put you out of business if you don't assist me in putting an unrelated competitor of ours out of business" is worse to you than "you may only use Objective C to develop on this device"?

I don't like Objective C either, but I don't take it that far.

Re: Steve Jobs Has Just Gone Mad

#30

Post by tptacek »

CamperBob wrote: post #23
tptacek wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

REALLY. Saying "no alternate compilers on our hardware" is worse than using the threat of yanking OEM licenses for the then-monopoly desktop OS if they dared to feature another company's browser on the desktop?

Yes, it is. My in-house process is none of Apple's (or Microsoft's) business.

As you have just found out, it in fact is. Maybe I'm wrong, but my guess is: they win this issue, and they still keep the overwhelming lead in app development.
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