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Swedish court upholds Assange arrest warrant

reuters.com

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Re: Swedish court upholds Assange arrest warrant

#111

Post by Arnt »

DasIch wrote: post #109
Arnt wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can you suggest that as a general principle? The current rules for extradition do have their reasons. You may not want Germany to be able to enforce its strict rules about nazi speech all over the world, or Turkey to be able to imprison people who've offended Erdogan. Haggling over extradition is not unusual. For example, the US has promised not to use capital punishment in order to extradite people from countries th…

There is no request for extradition over which anyone could haggle. There is no concrete evidence that the US is going to make such a request. If there would be a request, as you say yourself, Sweden doesn't necessarily have to honor it, for example if Assange faces capital punishment. Assange could probably fight extradition in court also. In any case this is nothing here to suggest that this is anything more than a…

Sweden asked Britain to extradite him, and Assange is haggling: "I'll come if you'll let me go wherever I please afterwards". That "if" may be insincere but IMO it counts as haggling.

Re: Swedish court upholds Assange arrest warrant

#112

Post by whamlastxmas »

notahacker wrote: post #102
chmars wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Rather extradited – to Sweden or the US, the latter maybe via Sweden … that seems to be the real issue, not the rape accusations (although rape accusations are known as a powerful weapon to destroy enemies – although that does of course not rule out that Assange is actually a rapist under Swedish law).

I think it's quite difficult to sustain the argument that the rape accusations aren't the real issue when he's twice fled jurisdiction on the day it became certain he would be charged with rape if he didn't. If the US had wanted to try to extradite him through legal means, the US had ample opportunity to arrange it during the period Assange was calmly reporting to the UK police every day whilst his legal team tried t…

Fleeing at convenient timing is evidence that the threat of getting arrested and extradited was real. It says nothing about the validity of the sexual assault claims.

Re: Swedish court upholds Assange arrest warrant

#113

Post by whamlastxmas »

PJDK wrote: post #31
dummkopf99 wrote: post #17

So you believe the rape accusations are valid? If you think that it is not politically motivated or that Sweden will not hand him over to the US as soon as they get him, you must be incredibly naive.

What does hand over mean. Assange isn't wanted in America, and as far as I'm aware hasn't broken any US laws either. I'm sure you can find some quotes from blowhard politicians saying something mean about him, but that's not how the justice system works. So what does hand over mean? And why would neutral Sweden be more likely to hand him over than closest ally, special relationship, NATO and 5 Eyes member Britain?

Saying Assange isn't wanted in the US (and wouldn't be arrested if he came) is the equivalent of waving your hands on someone's face and saying "lalallala I'm not touching you". There's not a literal arrest warrant but you're being tremendously naive or deliberately obtuse if you think he wouldn't be arrested at customs.

Re: Swedish court upholds Assange arrest warrant

#114

Post by [deleted] »

PJDK wrote: post #31
dummkopf99 wrote: post #17

So you believe the rape accusations are valid? If you think that it is not politically motivated or that Sweden will not hand him over to the US as soon as they get him, you must be incredibly naive.

What does hand over mean. Assange isn't wanted in America, and as far as I'm aware hasn't broken any US laws either. I'm sure you can find some quotes from blowhard politicians saying something mean about him, but that's not how the justice system works. So what does hand over mean? And why would neutral Sweden be more likely to hand him over than closest ally, special relationship, NATO and 5 Eyes member Britain?

[deleted]

Re: Swedish court upholds Assange arrest warrant

#115

Post by whamlastxmas »

alkonaut wrote: post #104

It's funny how a few years ago Assange was portrayed as a hero fronting this exciting Wikileaks thing which leaked evidence of war crimes and stood up for the whistleblowers and the little man. Now he seems involved in some strange right-wing cabal involving everything from the Kremlin to Donald Trump? Was he that guy all along, or did he kind of turn into that side of things while stuck in the embassy?

It's thanks to the same media that villainizes and ruins the lives of people being tried (without conviction) of alleged crimes.

Re: Swedish court upholds Assange arrest warrant

#116

Post by berntb »

willvarfar wrote: post #30
berntb wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sorry, I thought my point was obvious -- it is hilariously obvious that the tenacity is not about the crime Assange stands accused of. (I'm not certain if Assange should be sent to a prison in the US or not. Releasing information, which certainly e.g. China and Russia already have, is not bad. On the other hand, releasing secret information must be prosecuted for a state's good.)

Living in Sweden, so kinda care that the police would work a bit harder. But its a massive leap to take general statistics and extrapolate that to one of the most heinous crimes of all - rape. Hopefully the overstretched police are overlooking the drunks and focusing on the rape and murder cases?

You would hope so. In today's news, the police just forgot about when a 72 year old got a gun to his head when visiting a graveyard.

Rather, crime in Sweden is deemed important if a case reach the media. That is a more likely explanation to the situation (without external influences).

So e.g. the case of the old man getting a gun to his head I noted above will probably be solved now, if it still is possible after so long a time.

(And e.g. removing the condom during consensual sex, like Assange, is defined as "rape" in Sweden, but is hardly the upper half of that definition.)

Re: Swedish court upholds Assange arrest warrant

#117

Post by phicoh »

dagw wrote: post #105
Mtinie wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

IANAL, and I'm definitely not current on how the Scandinavian legal system works. I'm hoping someone can summarize this: Why can't he be charged while he's still in the Embassy? I understand that enforcing any judgement rendered by a court becomes a hang up because of his asylum, but that's a separate concern.

Because in Sweden, procedurally, you do not get charged until you are in custody. Largely because they don't want to make it a separate concern as you put it.

I'm my opinion this goes against european human rights. As soon as Sweden asked for him to be extradited from England, the clock starts ticking. After two years, they violated his right to a speedy trail and he is free to go.

I'm really sad that his hasn't gone to the European Court of Human Right to decide against Sweden (or England, because it is actually England that is keeping him locked up).

Note that I do not have a high opinion of Assange, and it is quite possible that according to Swedish law he did rape those women. But he should have been entitled to a trial in absentia.

Re: Swedish court upholds Assange arrest warrant

#118

Post by openmosix »

phicoh wrote: post #117
dagw wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because in Sweden, procedurally, you do not get charged until you are in custody. Largely because they don't want to make it a separate concern as you put it.

I'm my opinion this goes against european human rights. As soon as Sweden asked for him to be extradited from England, the clock starts ticking. After two years, they violated his right to a speedy trail and he is free to go. I'm really sad that his hasn't gone to the European Court of Human Right to decide against Sweden (or England, because it is actually England that is keeping him locked up). Note that I do not h…

So if as a regular citizen I commit 2 rapes (and they know who I am) if I am able to disappear for 2 years, then I'm free? That's convenient.

Re: Swedish court upholds Assange arrest warrant

#119

Post by sctb »

boxkite wrote: post #35

Assange is a nutjob who grew up in Australia during the cold war as a teenage hacker thinking the world was going to end. His paranoia and sense of dread lead him to picking the biggest fight in the world possible. Potentially people have died because of what he did, but also the public has an amazing resource for understanding the larger powers at will in the world around them. If I have to get armchair about the ra…

We detached this subthread from https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12513082 and marked it off-topic.

Re: Swedish court upholds Assange arrest warrant

#120

Post by sctb »

dummkopf99 wrote: post #17

So you believe the rape accusations are valid? If you think that it is not politically motivated or that Sweden will not hand him over to the US as soon as they get him, you must be incredibly naive.

We detached this subthread from https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12513082 and marked it off-topic.
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