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Swedish court upholds Assange arrest warrant

reuters.com

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Re: Swedish court upholds Assange arrest warrant

#81

Post by chmars »

Xylakant wrote: post #34
chmars wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not guilty until proven? And the stay at the embassy is for political reasons – and like a prison sentence (in a civilized country where prison sentences are about the loss of freedom and not the loss of living as a human being).

> Not guilty until proven? There was no assumption of guilt in the parents post. There's an open accusation and it's absolutely normal that people get arrested for rape accusations. Rape is a serious crime and needs to be prosecuted. The stay at the embassy is self-inflicted. Nobody but Assange chose to violate the conditions of his bail. Assange still is master of his own destiny and could end this at any point. He…

I find few reasons to disagree with you, especially the possible Internet access is a very important point. Thanks!

Re: Swedish court upholds Assange arrest warrant

#82

Post by Ressuder »

onion2k wrote: post #42
willvarfar wrote: post #8

Someone accused of rape should not be given refuge to wait it out. Its easy for armchair conspiracists to imagine this whole thing an elaborate ruse to extradite Assange to the US, but Assange was being questioned in Sweden before he fled from there and on bail in the UK prior to 'fleeing' to the Ecuadorian embassy. It seems a very roundabout way for the Americans to get at him. Occams Razor Assange is fleeing justic…

You're absolutely right, Assange should face his accusers in court. That's obvious. The problem is that Sweden and the UK are complicit in America's desire to seize Assange and put him in prison without even the possibility of a fair trial, and the first step in that process is his extradition to the US from either the UK or Sweden. That is what's interfering with the case and what Assange is fleeing from, not the ra…

It's an unrealistic demand, which Assange is fully aware of. The Swedish constitution makes it illegal for politicians to interfer with the judicial system.

Our laws do also, by the way, make it impossible for us to extradite him to the US without the consent of the UK, so it seems awfully convenient that he claims that he would trust an illegal guarantee by the Swedish government but not that it would follow it's own laws. That is, unless the UK is the problem - but then why the hell did he go there in the first place, and stayed there?

Re: Swedish court upholds Assange arrest warrant

#83

Post by eli »

Arnt wrote: post #68
eli wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

By what process could his guilt possibly be provable if he refuses to leave the embassy?

Not relevant, because he doesn't. He refuses to go anywhere that makes him extraditable to the US. The Swedish, in turn, say roughly "our general rules are such that we can't guarantee that, and an exception isn't practically possible". Which makes sense, it's arguably better to have plain and simple rules than ones that cover every last edge case. Personally, I think the Swedish should bend their laws. Globalisation…

Sweden shouldn't have to bargain or compromise with someone accused of a crime just because that person is picky about what countries they set foot in for their own reasons.

IF there are US charges against him and IF the US tries to extradite then I'm sure he'll have an opportunity to fight it.

Re: Swedish court upholds Assange arrest warrant

#84

Post by [deleted] »

chmars wrote: post #77
notahacker wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He is free to go wherever he wants until he is charged. It's just that if he goes outside the Ecuadorian embassy, he will be charged.

Rather extradited – to Sweden or the US, the latter maybe via Sweden … that seems to be the real issue, not the rape accusations (although rape accusations are known as a powerful weapon to destroy enemies – although that does of course not rule out that Assange is actually a rapist under Swedish law).

[deleted]

Re: Swedish court upholds Assange arrest warrant

#85

Post by belorn »

eli wrote: post #67
mtgx wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The US gov has charges against Assange lined-up. They're just waiting for the opportunity to bring him in. http://www.mediaite.com/tv/assange-why-is-doj-wikileaks-inve...

I don't think that's true and your link doesn't support there even being any charges against him, let alone there being a plan to extradite.

http://www.svt.se/ug/julian-assange-riskerar-utlamning-till-...

Why would a nation give a warrant for communication data associated with a person, close down that persons bank accounts, and send investigators to interview people close to the person and request evidence? Those are the supporting evidence, and while it doesn't conclusively prove anything, some people would conclude that it is enough to warrant caution.

Re: Swedish court upholds Assange arrest warrant

#86

Post by Tomte »

ntlve wrote: post #59
assangesnowden wrote: post #52

You also have to understand the current political climate in Sweden. Assange's case is the ONLY rape that is disclosed/covered publicly. The 3000% increase in rapes due to immigration forced the government to ban the reporting on rapes to prevent racism. That also includes internet censorship, including foreign news sites.

Do you have a source for that number?

His racism, obviously.

Standard immigrant-hatred. Very much en vogue throughout Europe right now.

Re: Swedish court upholds Assange arrest warrant

#87

Post by pessimizer »

DanBC wrote: post #76
onion2k wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're absolutely right, Assange should face his accusers in court. That's obvious. The problem is that Sweden and the UK are complicit in America's desire to seize Assange and put him in prison without even the possibility of a fair trial, and the first step in that process is his extradition to the US from either the UK or Sweden. That is what's interfering with the case and what Assange is fleeing from, not the ra…

> The problem is that Sweden and the UK are complicit The UK isn't that complicit, because he's been here for a while and the UK has done fuck all.

Since when has "fuck all" cost £10m?

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-31159594

Re: Swedish court upholds Assange arrest warrant

#88

Post by onion2k »

DanBC wrote: post #76
onion2k wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're absolutely right, Assange should face his accusers in court. That's obvious. The problem is that Sweden and the UK are complicit in America's desire to seize Assange and put him in prison without even the possibility of a fair trial, and the first step in that process is his extradition to the US from either the UK or Sweden. That is what's interfering with the case and what Assange is fleeing from, not the ra…

> The problem is that Sweden and the UK are complicit The UK isn't that complicit, because he's been here for a while and the UK has done fuck all.

Legally an embassy is a tiny parcel of sovereign land that belongs to the country it's an embassy of, so strictly speaking, he's in Ecuador.

Re: Swedish court upholds Assange arrest warrant

#89

Post by pessimizer »

eli wrote: post #70
onion2k wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're absolutely right, Assange should face his accusers in court. That's obvious. The problem is that Sweden and the UK are complicit in America's desire to seize Assange and put him in prison without even the possibility of a fair trial, and the first step in that process is his extradition to the US from either the UK or Sweden. That is what's interfering with the case and what Assange is fleeing from, not the ra…

If Assange is facing charges in the US (and I don't think there's any evidence he is) then that's his problem. You don't get to avoid prosecution for a crime because it is politically or legally inconvenient for you.

It clearly is his problem, because he's been stuck in the Ecuadorian embassy for years. That sounds like his problem.

> You don't get to avoid prosecution for a crime because it is politically or legally inconvenient for you.

You clearly do, if the alternative for the people who want to prosecute you is to violate international norms and storm an embassy.

Re: Swedish court upholds Assange arrest warrant

#90

Post by Arnt »

eli wrote: post #83
Arnt wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not relevant, because he doesn't. He refuses to go anywhere that makes him extraditable to the US. The Swedish, in turn, say roughly "our general rules are such that we can't guarantee that, and an exception isn't practically possible". Which makes sense, it's arguably better to have plain and simple rules than ones that cover every last edge case. Personally, I think the Swedish should bend their laws. Globalisation…

Sweden shouldn't have to bargain or compromise with someone accused of a crime just because that person is picky about what countries they set foot in for their own reasons. IF there are US charges against him and IF the US tries to extradite then I'm sure he'll have an opportunity to fight it.

Can you suggest that as a general principle?

The current rules for extradition do have their reasons. You may not want Germany to be able to enforce its strict rules about nazi speech all over the world, or Turkey to be able to imprison people who've offended Erdogan.

Haggling over extradition is not unusual. For example, the US has promised not to use capital punishment in order to extradite people from countries that forbid capital punishment.

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