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Leaked Apple emails reveal employees' complaints about toxic work environment

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Re: Leaked Apple emails reveal employees' complaints about toxic work environment

#121
post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> This is quite literally the first I've ever heard this. Then it's good that you heard about it now, so you don't do it to anyone in the future! Here's some references to better understand why this is a bad thing: * http://www.huffingtonpost.com/erika-hardison/its-important-f... * http://www.npr.org/sections/goatsandsoda/2016/04/09/47343350...

My take away from this is that if something so innocuous can be considered so offensive it's much easier to avoid casual conversations with women at work entirely.

I'm a guy, and if you told me to smile or to cheer up because my resting face wasn't happy enough for you, and especially if I've had a rough day, I'd tell you to fall down a flight of stairs with a grin on my face.

This goes for a lot of that stupid shit people who barely know each other seem obligated to say at each other in the office. No one needs it. I mean just a polite nod acknowledging one's existence is fine, or maybe a "Good Morning". Let's stop all this "How are you?" with people we aren't even on a first name basis with. I mean do you really want to know the answer?

And if you don't know a person well enough to know if they're mad or they just look a certain way while they're deep in thought or rushing off somewhere, then don't say anything. It's _totes annoying_ and presumptuous. You saying a kind word while passing in the hallway is not going to magically unfuck someone's day.

Although holding doors when lugging laptop bags and so forth is always appreciated. Please continue to do this if you do. That just might unfuck someone's day a little bit.

Re: Leaked Apple emails reveal employees' complaints about toxic work environment

#122

I'm risking a lot here... Apple employee here: I only want to provide context. None of us want a toxic environment. We, at Apple, pride ourselves on the fact that we are accepting of all backgrounds, nationalities, genders, religions. I, personally, have struggled with ensuring a diverse set of folks on my team or all backgrounds. We love the fact that we're helping to lead the industry with regard to diversity. And…

> We, at Apple, pride ourselves on the fact that we are accepting of all backgrounds, nationalities, genders, religions.

Reads like a PR boilerplate.

Re: Leaked Apple emails reveal employees' complaints about toxic work environment

#123
post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why is the onus on me to be aware of what every sub group considers offensive? Why isn't the onus on the sub group to recognize that they are a minority and that not everyone around them has to meet their standards of what is and isn't offensive?

because in a workspace the culture is one of inclusiveness, the onus on you is to be inclusive, I'm sorry to say, that's going to require some awareness on your part. But don't worry, it will likely just make you a better person overall.

A workplace is not required to ensure you're not offended, only that you're not sexually harassed, harrases in general, or discriminated against (if a protected class). A workplace can also not force inclusiveness.

I fear that the swing in PC culture is going to cause more harm than good for "inclusiveness" now that the pendulum has swung too far.

Re: Leaked Apple emails reveal employees' complaints about toxic work environment

#124
post #119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I spent nearly 20 years working in a Northern Irish company in which in-office discussion of politics, religion and most sport was banned, on pain of disciplinary action. On occasion people were asked to stop bringing their choice of newspaper into the office, too, as this could be construed as a subtle political signal. After a few months one adapted to restricting the domain of conversation without much effort, and…

Politics and religion were particularly touchy in Northern Ireland, but why sport?

I'm not familiar with the situation in Ireland but in Scotland the Celtic / Rangers rivalry has a strong religious element to it.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Old_Firm

Re: Leaked Apple emails reveal employees' complaints about toxic work environment

#125
post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Person 4's fascist solipsism is astounding. She has transferred the "toxicity" and "unacceptability"in her own mind onto the whole team. A song was referred to but there was no actual mention of sexual assault. The song is not "completely unacceptable" as it is obviously commonly known and legally sold. It is therefore acceptable in the workplace, referred to as it actually was.

It's also clear that she has listened to the song enough to know the words too. So she was happy offending herself.

Good point.

I don't know the song myself. If I worked at Apple I'd have reported person 1 for not being inclusive enough...

Re: Leaked Apple emails reveal employees' complaints about toxic work environment

#126
post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Person 4's fascist solipsism is astounding. She has transferred the "toxicity" and "unacceptability"in her own mind onto the whole team. A song was referred to but there was no actual mention of sexual assault. The song is not "completely unacceptable" as it is obviously commonly known and legally sold. It is therefore acceptable in the workplace, referred to as it actually was.

It's also clear that she has listened to the song enough to know the words too. So she was happy offending herself.

[deleted]

Re: Leaked Apple emails reveal employees' complaints about toxic work environment

#127
post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Person 4's fascist solipsism is astounding. She has transferred the "toxicity" and "unacceptability"in her own mind onto the whole team. A song was referred to but there was no actual mention of sexual assault. The song is not "completely unacceptable" as it is obviously commonly known and legally sold. It is therefore acceptable in the workplace, referred to as it actually was.

It's also clear that she has listened to the song enough to know the words too. So she was happy offending herself.

[deleted]

Re: Leaked Apple emails reveal employees' complaints about toxic work environment

#128
post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Person 4's fascist solipsism is astounding. She has transferred the "toxicity" and "unacceptability"in her own mind onto the whole team. A song was referred to but there was no actual mention of sexual assault. The song is not "completely unacceptable" as it is obviously commonly known and legally sold. It is therefore acceptable in the workplace, referred to as it actually was.

It's also clear that she has listened to the song enough to know the words too. So she was happy offending herself.

[deleted]

Re: Leaked Apple emails reveal employees' complaints about toxic work environment

#129

Is it just me or is this ultra-political correctness a new and intresting phenomenon? I'm really interested to watch where it's all going. Pretty much all jokes are going to offend somebody. You can't ask people to smile, comment on thier clothes or belongings. You can't interact causally in the workplace at all. Perhaps we'll see workplaces where all communication is in writing and on topic. Do we want our workplace…

I found Slavoj Zizek has a very interesting perspective on "racist jokes" as a bonding factor in _diverse_ communities https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ri0qiAita4s (approx. 10m)

Re: Leaked Apple emails reveal employees' complaints about toxic work environment

#130

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Still, rape jokes are not acceptable. Perhaps, but it's not something that is obviously unacceptable. I would put it on the same level as making a joke about an intruder coming to bomb/shoot everyone. Certainly it's in poor taste, but that's the level of humour you find everywhere.

if that was a real and possible threat to someone, then that would be totally unacceptable as well. Pretty sure people who went through 9/11 would not appreciate that. Thing is, it's not found everywhere, there are very respectful workplace environments. If people do cross the line it is called out and dealt with and quite quickly things converge on what is acceptable and what's not.

It’s a shitty joke. Just move on. It shouldn’t be the company’s business to legislate whether jokes are in good taste. If just one person is uncomfortable on that team, they should just be put on another team, no questions asked. An entire team shouldn’t have to adjust their speech for just one uncomfortable person, especially when just one slip-up prompts that incident being shared company-wide in a massive and petty shaming attempt.
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