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Pardon Snowden

pardonsnowden.org

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Re: Pardon Snowden

#581

Post by codeddesign »

BFatts wrote: post #548
kristopolous wrote: post #514

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ah the Espionage Act. It's written by the organization that will penalize you if you speak out against them - but don't worry, they're dedicated to protect your speech even if you speak out against them.

Yeah, laws, acts, and shit suck, right? Because they weren't written by me, especially, by your tally. Maybe if you folks would stop worrying about being "put on some list" as if that'll happen because you say "Snowden should be pardoned!" What about the list for us good people that say "Snowden should be tried and jailed!" Don't you want to be on OUR list?

Good people? I believe the argument is that these "good people" would be counted as sheep compared to those that would be against the powers that be. So yes, you would be counted as "good sheeple"

Re: Pardon Snowden

#582

Post by yodsanklai »

TaylorAlexander wrote: post #388
clarkmoody wrote: post #344

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> A mode of thought I would expect in socialist countries, not the US... The United States government has done an excellent bit of propaganda to convince the bulk of the public that they are the most free people on earth. We salute the flag and sing the national anthem at games. We have the presidents' pictures on the walls of our classrooms. We chant "USA" at political rallies. But the government of the United State…

Noam Chomsky talks a lot about "Manufacturing Consent" (he wrote a book with this title). He says that in a democratic society you can't use force to control people, so you have to control them by controlling attitudes an opinions instead. It works well, and the people of the United States are heavily controlled by the elite, who in this case are the corporations and the media companies they control. https://www.yout…

I tend to agree with Chomsky's views, but sometimes I feel he's too extreme and that makes him lose credibility. Maybe it's my misunderstanding, but he often sounds like there is a bunch of people, "the elite" that plan together how they are going to control the rest of the world. I see this instead as a natural, non-coordinated phenomenon caused by various powerful people trying to serve their self-interests.

Re: Pardon Snowden

#583

Post by kristopolous »

BFatts wrote: post #548
kristopolous wrote: post #514

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ah the Espionage Act. It's written by the organization that will penalize you if you speak out against them - but don't worry, they're dedicated to protect your speech even if you speak out against them.

Yeah, laws, acts, and shit suck, right? Because they weren't written by me, especially, by your tally. Maybe if you folks would stop worrying about being "put on some list" as if that'll happen because you say "Snowden should be pardoned!" What about the list for us good people that say "Snowden should be tried and jailed!" Don't you want to be on OUR list?

My apologies. What exactly is your position here?

Re: Pardon Snowden

#585

Post by [deleted] »

Inlinked wrote: post #512

To pardon Snowden seems like a very popular opinion around here. Can anyone help me change my opinion on this matter? The way I currently see it: - Snowden indiscriminately hovered up so many documents, it was impossible to vet all of them. - The vast majority of these documents do not constitute whistleblowing, but are standard operating procedure for the NSA. The US expects the NSA to do this. - Leaking standard-op…

[deleted]

Re: Pardon Snowden

#586

Post by spdustin »

peterkelly wrote: post #347
captainmuon wrote: post #60

Maybe a naive question, but what would the risk be for me to sign this? I wonder if I (a US citizen) might get trouble the next time at the border? Or get a higher score in some database, that combined with other things might get me into trouble? Increased scrutiny from the IRS (which should have nothing to do with this, but "they" might say hell why not?)? Inability to get security clearances in future? Being target…

This is the so-called "chilling effect" that's one of the most worrying implications of mass surveillance on a society... people feel afraid to speak out due to a concern they may be added to a list of some sort, and face negative real-life repercussions due to expressing their free speech. There were a couple of times where I actually called the public contact numbers for NSA & GCHQ regarding particular stories abou…

Got me wondering if one's PGP fingerprint (or other cryptographic fingerprints) are "selectors" in XKEYSCORE

Re: Pardon Snowden

#587

Post by obelos »

captainmuon wrote: post #60

Maybe a naive question, but what would the risk be for me to sign this? I wonder if I (a US citizen) might get trouble the next time at the border? Or get a higher score in some database, that combined with other things might get me into trouble? Increased scrutiny from the IRS (which should have nothing to do with this, but "they" might say hell why not?)? Inability to get security clearances in future? Being target…

Pretty sure I was denied clearance because I had made pro-Snowden remarks in public.

Re: Pardon Snowden

#588

Post by kybernetikos »

iso-8859-1 wrote: post #115
JMCQ87 wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I hope that was sarcastic. Otherwise it's hilarious, especially in this context.

I hope that was sarcastic. Otherwise you are implying that the humor value of a comment is determined not solely by you, but partly from the intentions of the author.

The perceived intentions of the author/utterer absolutely affect the humour value of a comment.

Re: Pardon Snowden

#589

Post by cureyourhead »

Well he was a patsy so pardoning him reduces the risk he will blow true story of the most successful increase in intelligence gathering capacity since WWII... So there's that. Pardon him for sure. And never doubt he's a patriot. But he doesn't believe in openness. He helped usher in a new age of secrecy. I think that's a good thing. I also think people should actually know the real.

Re: Pardon Snowden

#590

Post by anigbrowl »

You can't pardon someone who hasn't been convicted of anything, or even tried. Why are so many hackers unwilling to learn the basics of civics? The governmental system we have sucks, but if you're going to petition for people to act within that framework then the least you could do is develop a basic working knowledge of it first. It is neither legally possible nor politically feasible for President Obama to pardon Snowden. To attempt to do so pre-emptively would be grounds for impeachment.

Cripes, I'm not even American and I'm getting really tired of explaining legal & civic fundamentals to Americans who didn't pay any attention to the topic in school. Are so many of you really so dense that your critical thinking skills can be suspended by presenting you with a pretty landing page? Wake the fuck up.

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