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Soaring Student Debt Prompts Calls for Relief

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Re: Soaring Student Debt Prompts Calls for Relief

#441

Post by joshkpeterson »

refurb wrote: post #383
metaphorm wrote: post #212

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Am I the only one who hates the notion of being forced to pay for other people's bad financial decisions? you've got a serious lack of perspective if that's what you think this is

That exactly what this is. Person A goes to school, takes out loans, diligently pays them back. Person B does the exact same thing, but gets his/her loans forgiven. How is that fair?

It's not fair, but this is all fucked and we need to be subsidizing everyone's education, like most other developed nations, because that's what's best for the economy and society. OP's comment is a derail.

Re: Soaring Student Debt Prompts Calls for Relief

#442

Post by hyperion2010 »

shanacarp wrote: post #435

I'm reminded of the U of C's Aims of Education Address when this discussion comes up. EG: https://aims.uchicago.edu/node/83 I tend to think that many things that are now in college degree programs are actually things that should be in trade programs - we've turned everything into a degree, and in the process, stopped realizing what the value of a degree is and/or what the purpose of a theory driven/liberal arts educa…

Was there in person for that address (was that 10 years ago...). In my view if you go to college today and don't get a real liberal education (distribution requirements!) then you have waisted your time and probably your money.

Re: Soaring Student Debt Prompts Calls for Relief

#443

Post by ant6n »

morgante wrote: post #197
viraptor wrote: post #188

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree with the conclusion, but: > other people's bad financial decisions? This is different than someone taking a bad loan on their own. This is the case of your parents and grandparents, your government, the schools, the newspapers, etc. all effectively telling you that it's a good idea to invest in education. So good that in a country that loves its liberties and independence so much people will fight against pub…

> Surely they can't be all wrong... I cannot honestly blame people for believing the lie in this case. I absolutely can. I grew up listening to all those same messages and hearing all the same things. I also realized that it might be a good idea to do some college research and to apply for various scholarships. High school seniors aren't babies. If they're good enough to get into a college, they should be smart enoug…

Bla bla I'm a more rugged individual than others... Screw everybody else!

Re: Soaring Student Debt Prompts Calls for Relief

#444

Post by ant6n »

outside1234 wrote: post #195
jonahrd wrote: post #184

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You may be right that it's a poor financial decision, but I still hope to one day live in a country where people can pursue education in any subject matter (not just STEM/other money makers) for the pure purpose of educational fulfillment. That can only be done with a system that helps pay for education instead of letting the market decide which degrees are most valuable in terms of pure capitalistic measures

Let me know when you find the hole in the ground that is shooting money up into the air that enables us to have luxuries like this. Frankly, we have thousands of other problems, highlighted by basic health care, that we should probably prioritize first.

Fascist countries don't need people with critical thinking skills, STEM I'd the only thing that matters.

Re: Soaring Student Debt Prompts Calls for Relief

#445

Post by Locke1689 »

WalterBright wrote: post #302
zanny wrote: post #294

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The class that lends is also the class whose marginal increases in wealth do not produce goods demand or consumption, it just goes back into lending and / or investment / and or bonds. The best way to grow an economy is to give a dollar to its poorest participant, not its richest, because the poor class will immediately spend it on goods, creating demand, where the richer you are the less of your income goes to consu…

This is another variation on the "rich people hoard money" theory. The reality is that rich people's lending, investment, and bonds all spend that money, too. Nobody borrows money unless they plan to spend it (otherwise it would make no sense). Nobody hoards cash.

In a low-inflation, sparse investment landscape it's actually quite likely that people will hoard cash.

Re: Soaring Student Debt Prompts Calls for Relief

#446

Post by sosborn »

friendlygrammar wrote: post #296
sosborn wrote: post #196

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> peak career earnings I make much more than that and I only have an B.A. in English.

Congrats, you are the exception to the rule.

My point is that I am not exceptional and I know many others in the same boat.

Re: Soaring Student Debt Prompts Calls for Relief

#447

Post by pjlegato »

gozur88 wrote: post #397
Haven_Monahan wrote: post #274

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This. This. THIS. Federally-backed student loans, undischargeable and given to all and sundry, to be spent wherever on whatever, is a gigantic short in the moral-hazard circuit. I would throw an actual party for any dictator in the US who would do to the colleges what Henry VIII did to the monasteries.

>Federally-backed student loans, undischargeable and given to all and sundry, to be spent wherever on whatever, is a gigantic short in the moral-hazard circuit. I'm not sure you're using the term "moral hazard" correctly. If the loans were dischargeable that would be a moral hazard, because the smart thing to do would be to borrow up to your eyeballs and then declare bankruptcy ten years later on graduation day.

It's a moral hazard for the banks and schools, not for the students. It induces banks to knowingly make loans that are unlikely to be repayable. It induces schools to tell students to take loans to attend programs that are very unlikely to ever lead to employment that will pay enough to be able to pay back the loans.

Re: Soaring Student Debt Prompts Calls for Relief

#448

Post by toomuchtodo »

DashRattlesnake wrote: post #271
mattmanser wrote: post #260

Earlier quoted context omitted.

7 years for a bad decision made when you were 18? That seems incredibly harsh. Then again, you Americans really don't believe in rehabilitation do you.

Do other countries allow people to declare bankruptcy and discharge their debt without consequences? The 7 year black mark is no one wanting to loan you money because you've shown you won't pay it back, and it's 7 years because the government says it can't be longer. It's not anything truly harsh like prison sentence or anything.

This is incorrect. Lenders are more likely to lend to you after bankruptcy, as you're not permitted to declare bankruptcy again for several years.

Now, if you're credit score is simply low due to negative marks from late payments or charge offs, yes, it's likely you won't be lent to again until you take action to raise your credit score (by making payments on time).

Re: Soaring Student Debt Prompts Calls for Relief

#450

Post by nstj »

Locke1689 wrote: post #445
WalterBright wrote: post #302

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is another variation on the "rich people hoard money" theory. The reality is that rich people's lending, investment, and bonds all spend that money, too. Nobody borrows money unless they plan to spend it (otherwise it would make no sense). Nobody hoards cash.

In a low-inflation, sparse investment landscape it's actually quite likely that people will hoard cash.

Physical cash under the bed? "Hoarding" cash in a bank account isn't really "hoarding" as those deposits are "loaned" into the economy.
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