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Neglected Food Bubbles: The Espresso Coffee Foam

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Re: Neglected Food Bubbles: The Espresso Coffee Foam

#81

Post by tedmiston »

BurningFrog wrote: post #51
luckydata wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ritual's coffee is terrible: acidic, unpleasant to the palate and lacking in aroma. I hope your coffee is better than theirs. - disclosure: I'm Italian and I believe espresso in San Francisco sucks almost universally

Could it be that taste differs in different parts of the world? Just trying to have everyone get along and get to be right.

Well, that, and if I'm not mistaken, the "default" coffee in Italy is a shot of espresso compared to the cup of filter coffee most of us drink in the US every day.

Re: Neglected Food Bubbles: The Espresso Coffee Foam

#82

Post by tedmiston »

saryant wrote: post #13
jazzyk wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For me, the only espresso which comes close to the Italian original (I visit southern Europe every year) is served at Eataly (the Flatiron location in Manhattan). I've tried many smaller coffeshops in Manhattan and Boston - often highly rated on Yelp - but they are not even close. Always a bit burnt or sour - a well done espresso is neither.

I've found that there is no correlation between Yelp ratings of a coffeeshop and actual coffee quality. It's just not what reviewers are necessarily looking for, especially compared to things like power outlets and ambience.

There's an app called Work Hard Anywhere that breaks down all of these other factors for a coffee shop in a way that Yelp doesn't. So if you only want to see the highest rated coffee at places with wifi, you can run that query.

http://workhardanywhere.com

Disclosure: I've been a beta tester for a while; I use it a lot.

Re: Neglected Food Bubbles: The Espresso Coffee Foam

#83

Post by mickeypi »

js2 wrote: post #62
BurningFrog wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Could it be that taste differs in different parts of the world? Just trying to have everyone get along and get to be right.

American coffee snob here (not that I necessarily have good taste though): I was blown away by the espresso in Italy. On a two-week trip, every espresso I had there was better than any espresso I've had in the U.S. Which isn't to say I haven't had great coffee in America, just not great espresso. I think mostly Americans just don't care about espresso. Pet peeve: high-end restaurants in the U.S. mostly don't care abo…

Couldn't agree more on the pet peeve. I've stopped having coffee after a great meal at a restaurant because inevitably they'll ruin it with a cup of something awful. Even in places like Vancouver, SF or Seattle with a very strong coffee culture, and where pretty much anyone in the food industry knows a good coffee.

Re: Neglected Food Bubbles: The Espresso Coffee Foam

#84

Post by tedmiston »

lytfyre wrote: post #22
jazzyk wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For me, the only espresso which comes close to the Italian original (I visit southern Europe every year) is served at Eataly (the Flatiron location in Manhattan). I've tried many smaller coffeshops in Manhattan and Boston - often highly rated on Yelp - but they are not even close. Always a bit burnt or sour - a well done espresso is neither.

There are different styles of espresso, with roasters and barista optimizing for very different tastes - the Italian/Mediterranean style is one, the "third wave" style that's more prevalent on the North American west coast and Australia (Seattle/Portland/Melbourne/London UK) is another, and Scandinavian/Northern European being a third. Then there's the many people who go to a coffee shop for a drink with a ton of syr…

Searching Foursquare / Yelp for "third wave coffee" vs "coffee" tends to turn up more relevant results for me. (But I still don't pay much attention to star ratings.)

Re: Neglected Food Bubbles: The Espresso Coffee Foam

#85

Post by vvdcect »

js2 wrote: post #62
BurningFrog wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Could it be that taste differs in different parts of the world? Just trying to have everyone get along and get to be right.

American coffee snob here (not that I necessarily have good taste though): I was blown away by the espresso in Italy. On a two-week trip, every espresso I had there was better than any espresso I've had in the U.S. Which isn't to say I haven't had great coffee in America, just not great espresso. I think mostly Americans just don't care about espresso. Pet peeve: high-end restaurants in the U.S. mostly don't care abo…

Yup the main reasons high end restaurants do this is because of consistency, a cup of coffee from a nespresso would always yield a 6/10 cup.

Re: Neglected Food Bubbles: The Espresso Coffee Foam

#86

Post by bkkk »

luckydata wrote: post #23
HoppedUpMenace wrote: post #20

My first machine to make espresso was a espresso/drip coffee combo. Not knowing any better, I was merely pulling strong coffee and not espresso shots. Then I got a stand alone espresso machine, much closer to the real deal but still a far cry from what a coffee roaster like Temple Coffee could make in their store. Finally, invested in a Breville BES870XL and after many trials and errors, my espresso shots are fairly…

Ritual's coffee is terrible: acidic, unpleasant to the palate and lacking in aroma. I hope your coffee is better than theirs. - disclosure: I'm Italian and I believe espresso in San Francisco sucks almost universally

It took me a while to figure this out.

I also grew up with italian espresso and I always wondered why all these crafty, specialist roasters (all over the world) can't do a drinkable espresso and always end up with undrinkable acid in a cup.

A lot of italian espresso blends are a mix Arrabica/Robusta. Robusta beans create the sought-after strong/bitterish italien espresso flavor and probably also reduce/mask/balance the acidity.

Robusta beans according to the crafty roasters are low quality garbage, and they only care about arrabica beans. Clever marketing by the arrabica industry? Robusta beans have a bad reputation because they are majorly used by cheap coffee brands - but not all robusta beans are the same either.

So because third wave/hipster coffee shops only do arrabica, but italian style espresso needs a blend. That's why we can't have a good things.

I simply order espresso machiato when i want an espresso, the bit of milk foam reduces acidity to an acceptable level.

There is a longer article somewhere on nytimes about this topic. can't find it anymore.

Re: Neglected Food Bubbles: The Espresso Coffee Foam

#87

Post by Ar-Curunir »

horshod wrote: post #56
205guy wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're equivocating. A random person knows his culture in a general way and is competent to make comparisons. The op was essentially saying his overall observation of espresso in the US does not overlap with his experience in Italy. Having lived in Europe myself, I also know this to be true. Further, that it happens in many food categories gives credence to the espresso observation: cheese, wine, bread, etc. It goes…

I am from India, living in the US and I have seen tons of Indian snobs saying the Indian food in the US is just not good enough. I just can't agree. I can imagine that the probability of finding good espresso may be much higher in Italy - maybe every corner cafe makes only the best coffee. But the idea that good espresso cannot be found anywhere in the US (or SFO), which is home to many Europeans, just seems a bit of…

Most Indian restaurants do not serve common Indian cuisine; no average Indian consumes saag paneer or "paneer tikka masala" on a regular basis. North Indians, on the other hand, have things like daal regularly; daals in Indian restaurants in the US suck almost universally. I haven't even seen a restaurant that serves rajma.

Maybe South Indian food is different, but I haven't had good North Indian food anywhere in the US.

Re: Neglected Food Bubbles: The Espresso Coffee Foam

#88

Post by tedmiston »

nathancahill wrote: post #78
nathancahill wrote: post #19

I've always loved espresso, and it is indeed difficult to pull a great shot. To learn more about the mechanics of it, I got a manual EspressoForge[0]. Combined with a good manual grinder (Lido 2), a thermometer, a scale, and a pressure gauge, you can control the main variables* by hand. Steep learning curve, but once you get it, there's something immensely satisfying about balancing all the variables and seeing that…

Pro tip: If you make espresso, try an Espresso Tonic, and espresso shot pulled over half a glass of tonic water and ice. It will change your world.

Also great in a flavored Pellegrino — one of the most popular drinks at my local shop.

Re: Neglected Food Bubbles: The Espresso Coffee Foam

#89

Post by tedmiston »

ino wrote: post #7
wildmusings wrote: post #4

You can actually simulate this at home with just a moka pot; no need for a fancy ultra-expensive espresso machine. Pour just a tiny amount of the espresso into a cup with sugar and beat it really hard with a spoon. Then pour the rest of the coffee into the same container. Voila, crema, or at least something that looks and feels like crema. I think this is a Cuban-American (maybe originally Cuban) innovation and growi…

Exactly. For best results do it with the very first coffee that rises from the moka.

I read that before, but what do you mean exactly? Do you pick up the moka while it's still bubbling and pour?

Re: Neglected Food Bubbles: The Espresso Coffee Foam

#90

Post by Swizec »

msandford wrote: post #71
mistersquid wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While I agree with your assessment of Ritual's coffee, with all due respect, your being Italian alone does not establish your competence in judging espresso. I do understand espresso originates from Italy. I'm just allowing for the possibility that some Italians are poor judges of espresso and some non-Italians are excellent judges of same. To my taste as a non-Italian, Blue Bottle espresso is delicious. The baristas…

It's hilarious watching people argue over preferences as though they were facts. Person 1: Steak is the best food! Person 2: No, pasta is the best food! Person 1: I am from Kobe Japan and steak is best! Person 2: I am from Italy and pasta is best! And so it goes. Both people are right and wrong at the same time. Preferences aren't universal facts.

How is steak pasta still not a thing? It's so obvious.
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