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Most Danish voters oppose government plans to cut the top rate of income tax

bloomberg.com

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Re: Most Danish voters oppose government plans to cut the top rate of income tax

#101

Post by spoonie »

manarth wrote: post #21
crdoconnor wrote: post #12

>The government's plan involves cutting the top rate of income tax by 5 percentage points >The main idea behind the change, which is now being discussed by parliament, is to make salaried work more attractive and woo some 40,000 people off welfare in the process. Not a bad plan for a country that faces labor shortages and growing pressure on its costly social safety net from an aging population. This is a sales pitch…

and raising personal allowances so as to boost the salaries of the lowest earners by an average of 7 percent So the plan is to cut the taxes of high-earners, as well as improving the tax-free allowance for everyone… Without increasing other taxes, or reducing spending? Where's the extra money coming from?

Regarding the personal allowance increase, I'm sad that the article glossed over this. I was really impressed that it was a tax cut for both the top bracket and "everyone". I wonder how the Danes would react if it was only an increase to the allowance, without the top bracket cut?

Re: Most Danish voters oppose government plans to cut the top rate of income tax

#102

Post by ulrikmoe »

hanspeter wrote: post #59
ulrikmoe wrote: post #25

This is simply not true. In Denmark we have a welfare and tax scheme that benefits the majority at the expense of the productive few and the poor (Director's law?). I have never met a danish entrepreneur who didn't complain about taxes, never ever... http://taxfoundation.org/sites/taxfoundation.org/files/docs/...

And I have never met one who did complain about taxes (I haven't asked about it either). The danish successful entrepreneur Morten Strunge recently entered the tax discussion saying that he did not think much about taxes and that current proposed tax reliefs would not make much difference to him. I see myself as an entrepreneur and I am not complaining about taxes. In fact I have a hard time seeing taxes as something…

How do you define "marginally less"? Open your eyes and look at the graph I posted.

Let me name the obvious few: Christensen and Fornais (Saxo Bank), Jesper Buch (Just Eat), Mads Peter Veiby (M1), Lars Tvede, Toke Kruse (billys), Martin Thorborg (Jubii/Amino/Dinero/Agera). They are all members of Liberal Alliance and all of them frequently advocate lower taxes. Janus Friis (Skype) fled the country to avoid taxes (nuff said). I have met at least 50 entrepreneurs who openly complained about the current level of taxation.

Re: Most Danish voters oppose government plans to cut the top rate of income tax

#103

Post by atemerev »

mattmanser wrote: post #82
tajen wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Had the same feeling about Australia vs France. In Australia I'd pay $120 for a tax agent (~1% of my income tax), it would be over and I'd be happy about it. In France I feel like I'm being chased, because it's such a socialist country: I earn €2000 per month after tax, I feel like I'm being told by the tax administration that I'm a thieve because I'm rich, even though they're the ones who attempted to double-tax me…

This is very disingenuous, it would be more transparent if you led with the fact you've got a (very) complicated tax situation. VAT is also not your contribution, it's a client's, you collect it because you can offset it. So that 63% figure is pure and utter nonsense.

> you've got a (very) complicated tax situation.

Living in two countries in increasingly common situation. Postdocs in Europe are required to move between countries by many grant programs (this is why me and my wife have 4 different residence permits in varied countries). Also we have a 2 years old daughter. Taxes and other bureaucracy are hell for us. And scientists are not particularly rich.

Re: Most Danish voters oppose government plans to cut the top rate of income tax

#104

Post by atemerev »

mattmanser wrote: post #82
tajen wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Had the same feeling about Australia vs France. In Australia I'd pay $120 for a tax agent (~1% of my income tax), it would be over and I'd be happy about it. In France I feel like I'm being chased, because it's such a socialist country: I earn €2000 per month after tax, I feel like I'm being told by the tax administration that I'm a thieve because I'm rich, even though they're the ones who attempted to double-tax me…

This is very disingenuous, it would be more transparent if you led with the fact you've got a (very) complicated tax situation. VAT is also not your contribution, it's a client's, you collect it because you can offset it. So that 63% figure is pure and utter nonsense.

VAT is everybody's contribution. When you spend salary, you pay VAT.

Re: Most Danish voters oppose government plans to cut the top rate of income tax

#105

Post by atemerev »

rayiner wrote: post #53
atemerev wrote: post #10

In other countries, taxes are complicated (no citation needed). There's income tax, but there are also social security payments, industry-specific taxes, etc. And you have to pay for your own education and healthcare! Danish tax is simple and all inclusive. It is around 50%, which is about the same as in US if all hidden obligatory payments are taken into account. But it is all inclusive: all education and healthcare…

Americans do not pay anywhere near 50% in taxes. A high income American that makes money as ordinary income (rather than capital gains) and does not own a house and lives in a high tax city will pay almost 50% if you factor in federal, state, healthcare, and sales tax. Everyone else pays a lot less. Typical including health insurance premium is probably around 30-35%. In a state like Georgia with a generous employer…

> A high income American that makes money as ordinary income (rather than capital gains) and does not own a house and lives in a high tax city will pay almost 50% if you factor in federal, state, healthcare, and sales tax.

You have just described a typical Hacker News reader, who lives in, say, San Francisco, has relatively high income, and pays rent.

Re: Most Danish voters oppose government plans to cut the top rate of income tax

#106

Post by strictnein »

VeejayRampay wrote: post #37
atemerev wrote: post #10

In other countries, taxes are complicated (no citation needed). There's income tax, but there are also social security payments, industry-specific taxes, etc. And you have to pay for your own education and healthcare! Danish tax is simple and all inclusive. It is around 50%, which is about the same as in US if all hidden obligatory payments are taken into account. But it is all inclusive: all education and healthcare…

Let's be serious here. I'm French, all for high taxes and all but please let's not delude ourselves thinking that American people pay "around 50%" taxes. As soon as you have enough money to afford it, you'll pay a tax lawyer to get that down to about 15% or something, thanks to a bajillion hidden tax system loopholes allowing the rich to get an advantage on the less fortunate. And even if you take into account the pr…

You have a very distorted view of the American system of taxes and the American systems of wealth redistribution. It appears you've learned most of it from popular culture.

Re: Most Danish voters oppose government plans to cut the top rate of income tax

#108

Post by tremon »

vlehto wrote: post #56
cerebellum42 wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not like they have VAT because they are in the EU. They had VAT since 1962, and they have had it at the current rate of 25% (higher than most EU countries) since 1992, which is way before the EU VAT directive was even a thing. Edit: Correction, the EU VAT directive actually has its origins before 1992, but still after Denmark already had its own VAT.

My point was that you can safely assume that any EU country has at least 15% VAT.

For non-essential goods. There are two VAT brackets, the low tariff is 5% minimum.

Re: Most Danish voters oppose government plans to cut the top rate of income tax

#109

Post by skummetmaelk »

MrJagil wrote: post #30
yummybear wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In fact there are several levels - municipal, state and church tax, bottom, middle and top tax. VAT, as well as other industry taxes, among other a tax on the air in softice and an special nut-tax.

Most of those do not interfere with the lives of the average Danish citizen. Church tax is interesting though, and highly debated. Everyone's leaving the churches, especially in Copenhagen. Many teenagers deregisters from the Church of Denmark[0] to save money; the usual counterargument is mostly based on history; i.e. we should support the churches for the buildings'(not the institution) historic value. [0] https://…

The church tax is not the only income for the church. It receives a large amount of money from the general tax, exactly to perform restorations of old buildings and cultural heritage. Even if you deregister from the church and therefore do not pay direct church tax, some of your tax kroner will go to the church anyway.

Re: Most Danish voters oppose government plans to cut the top rate of income tax

#110

Post by vonmoltke »

pjc50 wrote: post #67
hedgew wrote: post #35

I'm not in Denmark but in a very similar European country. I don't want the high taxes. The current taxes and mandatory payments feel unfair. The generations before us worked during the greatest economic boom in history, were mostly employed in safe and high paying government jobs (still are), bought houses before their values tripled, and are now receiving monthly pension payments that are almost twice what most you…

The intergenerational inequality is an increasingly serious problem, and as you suggest might kill the welfare state if it's no longer percieved to be fair. The flashpoints are more likely to be in the south of Europe, such as Greece.

The critical failure of the welfare state, as it is currently implemented, was that it relied on ever-increasing payrolls in the younger generations to fund the pensions and subsidies of the retirees. Once that breaks down, as it is starting to, so does the system built upon it.
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