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Fortress of Tedium: What I Learned as a Substitute Teacher

nytimes.com

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Re: Fortress of Tedium: What I Learned as a Substitute Teacher

#11

Post by bsder »

bitwize wrote: post #9
khedoros wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can think of three high school classes that were great because of the teachers (an English class, a geometry class, and a shop class), and maybe three that were great because of their self-learning nature (my first programming class, an engineering class, and an after-school electronics+engineering class taught by the shop teacher). For everything else, I've got to agree. Take my US History class. I think it's impo…

"Sure, I'll be able to write an essay on it for the test, because I know that's the requirement, but ask me 6 months later, and I won't be able to tell you much about it." Here's a secret: That's the point of the class. School is mainly there to teach you to take assignments, follow directions, and cough up results on demand, irrespective of whether you actually care about the subject. It's a much-in-demand business…

> Here's a secret: That's the point of the class. School is mainly there to teach you to take assignments, follow directions, and cough up results on demand, irrespective of whether you actually care about the subject. It's a much-in-demand business skill.

I get tired of people dumping on schools.

The problem with school is that most of the consumers of said education are unmotivated slackers whom you practically have to beat the information into.

There are many reasons for people to not like school (social aspects--both personal and community--certainly being a big problem), but, I have ZERO sympathy for anyone who complains that it was boring, uninteresting drudgery from an educational standpoint.

Yes, everybody has bumped into the teacher that is retired-in-place--these people exist in any long-lived institution including companies. But, dear God, most teachers are desperate for any student to show even a modicum of interest in what they are teaching. Even in the worst schools, there always seems to be a handful of teachers lighting the way.

If you found your education boring, it's because you didn't exert even the minimum amount of effort necessary to get the attention of those teachers. And that's your own damn fault.

Re: Fortress of Tedium: What I Learned as a Substitute Teacher

#12

Post by TillE »

bsder wrote: post #11
bitwize wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Sure, I'll be able to write an essay on it for the test, because I know that's the requirement, but ask me 6 months later, and I won't be able to tell you much about it." Here's a secret: That's the point of the class. School is mainly there to teach you to take assignments, follow directions, and cough up results on demand, irrespective of whether you actually care about the subject. It's a much-in-demand business…

> Here's a secret: That's the point of the class. School is mainly there to teach you to take assignments, follow directions, and cough up results on demand, irrespective of whether you actually care about the subject. It's a much-in-demand business skill. I get tired of people dumping on schools. The problem with school is that most of the consumers of said education are unmotivated slackers whom you practically hav…

Even assuming that bad teachers are the norm, there's always an interesting way to look at any subject. A curious mind will find those. Start by reading the textbook - again, some are awful, but most aren't.

Re: Fortress of Tedium: What I Learned as a Substitute Teacher

#13

Post by catshirt »

bsder wrote: post #11
bitwize wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Sure, I'll be able to write an essay on it for the test, because I know that's the requirement, but ask me 6 months later, and I won't be able to tell you much about it." Here's a secret: That's the point of the class. School is mainly there to teach you to take assignments, follow directions, and cough up results on demand, irrespective of whether you actually care about the subject. It's a much-in-demand business…

> Here's a secret: That's the point of the class. School is mainly there to teach you to take assignments, follow directions, and cough up results on demand, irrespective of whether you actually care about the subject. It's a much-in-demand business skill. I get tired of people dumping on schools. The problem with school is that most of the consumers of said education are unmotivated slackers whom you practically hav…

> "The problem with school is that most of the consumers of said education are unmotivated slackers whom you practically have to beat the information into."

I almost stopped reading after that bit and I kind of wish I did.

there is some, some truth to what you are saying. but to paint this picture that "the problem with school" is the students.... is disingenuous at best, completely ignorant at worst.

Re: Fortress of Tedium: What I Learned as a Substitute Teacher

#14

Post by jseliger »

By the way, one thing I have discovered (the hard way, mostly) in teaching as an adjunct is that there is no penalty for being boring but there can be a penalty for being interesting, at least for many values of "interesting." I wrote a post "How do you know when you’re being insensitive? How do you know when you’re funny?" (https://jakeseliger.com/2014/12/22/how-do-you-know-when-your...) that deals in part with these issues.

The tedium of the school system is real, but it is also in part a reaction to a simple nature fact: A single unhappy student (or parent) can cause a great deal of stress and a great number of problems for a given teacher or set of administrators. Consequently, the default of the individual teacher is towards material and processes that are inoffensive—and easy to grade on a pass-fail basis. The worry for many teachers and administrators is about the worst-case scenario.

I used to wonder why school is so boring and I used to promise myself that if I were in charge it'd be different. Now I know why.

Re: Fortress of Tedium: What I Learned as a Substitute Teacher

#17

Post by pjscott »

FeepingCreature wrote: post #10

Also, in a similar vein: SlateStarCodex Gives A Graduation Speech http://slatestarcodex.com/2014/05/23/ssc-gives-a-graduation-...

In the same vein, sure, but an order of magnitude more grim. And more beautiful. I'll recommend this article until the sun burns out. Or until the educational system gets its act together -- but I repeat myself.

Re: Fortress of Tedium: What I Learned as a Substitute Teacher

#18

Post by pjscott »

bitwize wrote: post #9
khedoros wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can think of three high school classes that were great because of the teachers (an English class, a geometry class, and a shop class), and maybe three that were great because of their self-learning nature (my first programming class, an engineering class, and an after-school electronics+engineering class taught by the shop teacher). For everything else, I've got to agree. Take my US History class. I think it's impo…

"Sure, I'll be able to write an essay on it for the test, because I know that's the requirement, but ask me 6 months later, and I won't be able to tell you much about it." Here's a secret: That's the point of the class. School is mainly there to teach you to take assignments, follow directions, and cough up results on demand, irrespective of whether you actually care about the subject. It's a much-in-demand business…

That's a very comforting idea. There's a scarier idea: school is not there for anything. It's not meant to teach you to conform, or to avoid conformity, or to remember who Douglas McArthur was, or to make you forget; it's not meant for anything. It is not meant. You are incidental to all this, and so am I, and so is everybody else. There is no purpose. There is no goal.

Re: Fortress of Tedium: What I Learned as a Substitute Teacher

#19

Post by khedoros »

bitwize wrote: post #9
khedoros wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can think of three high school classes that were great because of the teachers (an English class, a geometry class, and a shop class), and maybe three that were great because of their self-learning nature (my first programming class, an engineering class, and an after-school electronics+engineering class taught by the shop teacher). For everything else, I've got to agree. Take my US History class. I think it's impo…

"Sure, I'll be able to write an essay on it for the test, because I know that's the requirement, but ask me 6 months later, and I won't be able to tell you much about it." Here's a secret: That's the point of the class. School is mainly there to teach you to take assignments, follow directions, and cough up results on demand, irrespective of whether you actually care about the subject. It's a much-in-demand business…

Heh. Well, they failed at teaching that, then. I've learned to quickly do the things that interest me and leave the rest languishing on a "to do" pile for as long as I can justify.

Re: Fortress of Tedium: What I Learned as a Substitute Teacher

#20

Post by khedoros »

bsder wrote: post #11
bitwize wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Sure, I'll be able to write an essay on it for the test, because I know that's the requirement, but ask me 6 months later, and I won't be able to tell you much about it." Here's a secret: That's the point of the class. School is mainly there to teach you to take assignments, follow directions, and cough up results on demand, irrespective of whether you actually care about the subject. It's a much-in-demand business…

> Here's a secret: That's the point of the class. School is mainly there to teach you to take assignments, follow directions, and cough up results on demand, irrespective of whether you actually care about the subject. It's a much-in-demand business skill. I get tired of people dumping on schools. The problem with school is that most of the consumers of said education are unmotivated slackers whom you practically hav…

> The problem with school is that most of the consumers of said education are unmotivated slackers whom you practically have to beat the information into.

So, we agree there's a problem. It's immaterial if the issue is in the school itself or in the students. The material fact is that the tool you're using (the current educational system) isn't having the effect that you want (imparting useful information and useful ways to think about it).

Say that I've got a polished, high-quality product, heavily advertised, easily available, and cheap. But: sales numbers are terrible. Is it the potential customers that are the problem, or is it something about the product? Put another way, is it more useful to fight against the nature of the customers, or to modify the product into something that will convince them to buy and use it?

If most people are unmotivated, I don't think it's reasonable or constructive to just say "all well, they should've just tried harder". I think it's more useful to assume that they aren't inherently slackers and diagnose and fix the problems in the system to improve the experience for the students and the outcome for society, overall.

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