Earlier quoted context omitted.
Ask everyone you work with for coffee. Please don't omit the women. I've mentored new hires, and in that context it's easy to say, "hey can we get tea and talk about how the first few weeks have been?"
What about asking no one ? :) Some of us prefers to drink our coffee by ourselves.
Introducing “Ask a Female Engineer”
431–440 of 491 posts
Re: Introducing “Ask a Female Engineer”
#432Earlier quoted context omitted.
I used to think that's just how women are, too. Eventually I realized that I had been made to think so in service of a purpose not my own.
No, I mean if your spouse only cares to keep you away from other women, but doesn't care which men you associate with.
Perhaps a place to start might be: What would we say of a man who only cares to keep his wife away from other men?
Re: Introducing “Ask a Female Engineer”
#433Earlier quoted context omitted.
This is what annoys me. With a male colleague I don't have to size my words or rethink too much what to say to ask for a coffee and a chat about work. Even if you have the best intentions you end up having difficulties to express something that should be pretty straight forward. IMHO that's the difference that makes so hard to treat women as any other colleague.
This works the other way around as well. I can ask a male coworker for coffee, and suddenly he thinks I'm interested. It gets weird . Same sorts of things happens with guys I thought were just a friend - dating was the furthest from my mind. If I were to speculate, I think some of this has to do with the way we treat dating culture and flirting - lots of hidden meanings and things that aren't/shouldn't be said instea…
Re: Introducing “Ask a Female Engineer”
#434Earlier quoted context omitted.
I agree that things can be misinterpreted, but that's not a reason to avoid relationships with people. It's a reason to keep things clearly communicated. And if people choose to gossip and act like high schoolers, let them. Maybe call them out on it, depending on the nature of your professional/personal relationship this can be easier said than done. But, maybe this is just me, I'm not going to forfeit my good relati…
Are you single? You sound single.
I have a good enough relationship that we can both express distrust for the friend, but that isn't something binding or obligatory to follow. If I find myself jealous, that is a problem I need to overcome and not take out on him and I expect him to do the same. I don't have reasons not to trust him, and if one doesn't trust their spouse, perhaps they should address that issue.
I'd not enter into a long-term relationship thinking this wasn't the case, honestly.
Re: Introducing “Ask a Female Engineer”
#435Earlier quoted context omitted.
Exactly my thought. For anybody interested in the topic of abuse, I strongly recommend, "Why Does He Do That? Inside the Minds of Angry and Controlling Men": http://www.amazon.com/Why-Does-He-That-Controlling/dp/042519... It is the single most astute book I have read. The author, a domestic violence counselor for men, mostly had clients who were court-ordered to attend his sessions. He spent a decade listening to vas…
Such a book has a great deal of value, to be sure. Is it possible that there are significant differences in the way abusive men behave, and the way abusive women do, such that more is required to make a book useful to abused men than simply taking a book written for a female audience and swapping pronoun genders throughout? It seems possible to me. And the book you mentioned implicitly disclaims relevance to a situat…
I think that a lot of the core dynamic is similar, so I'd expect the book to be useful to anybody in spotting patterns of abuse and control. Personally, I found the book much more widely useful than the author's intent. But if someone in your position didn't want the uphill struggle of trying to read themselves into a book that didn't start out from an inclusive stance, I'd totally understand. Not only is that a lot to take on when somebody is already struggling, but I'm sure important differences would be missed.
Re: Introducing “Ask a Female Engineer”
#436Earlier quoted context omitted.
Or maybe you can't justify the value of simply stating female in the topic heading. Or are you saying that all females have the same experience? if not perhaps you can explain what is the value of stating they are female when not all females are the same , nor do they automatically have the same experiences simply because of their sex. surely a fat , short , ugly , female engineer would not have the same experience o…
> Or maybe you can't justify the value of simply stating female in the topic heading. Stop it already: point is it should be OK for anyone to start any group they want but some are bound to be more interesting than others. You are starting to annoy even me and I'm definitely a non-"SJW". (although I do care and will sometimes make an effort to fix things, just not in a "SJW" style blame-society-and-all-white-men way)
So according to you the point is that it should be OK for anyone to start any group they want , however its not ok to ask any question.
On a good note despite your hypocrisy on allowing any subject to be created while controlling the questions that can be asked, you atleast have been consistent.
You have been consistent in making personal attacks and dodging the questions on the value of stating "Female" engineer. Good job!
I never said it was wrong to start the thread with that title, I just questioned the purpose or value to include female the in title.
Re: Introducing “Ask a Female Engineer”
#437Earlier quoted context omitted.
No. I prefer to watch movies snd shows alone, so attention needs not to be divided.
"Netflix and chill" is current code for having sex. The idea is that you go over to someone's house turn on Netflix and proceed to ignore it while you have sex. @hnbroseph was playing off of the fact that this is another phrase that when taken literally is innocent, but has implied meaning in a certain cultural context. Though "Netflix and chill" is probably less ambiguous in most cases since it wasn't a commonly use…
Re: Introducing “Ask a Female Engineer”
#438Earlier quoted context omitted.
As a guy myself, I am in favor of guys being active. Men, after all, embody most of the problem; leaving it to women to solve is putting a burden on people who are already getting a raw deal. But yes, guys should be aware that their common instinct to come in and dominate a thing will often not be well received. Partly because dudes pushing to dominate is how the problem was created and is maintained. Partly because…
An emphatic male absolutely does know more about what "women are going through" than, say, a narcissistic female just parroting lines she saw work for others, ripping other females to shreds as she strives for power. If you honestly have not ever seen that , keep your eyes peeled. If anything, I'd say privilege based on treating people as abstract monoliths and having double standards, and being unfair and abusive to…
Did you mean a different word here? Because as far as I've seen, the emphatic males are the biggest problem in this context.
> You know nothing about what others think about, what they know or don't know.
Do you recognize the multiple ironies in this statement?
Yes, I'm generalizing. That is a necessity in discussions about broad characteristics. You don't have to have a Not All Men explosion [1] because you don't feel like a general statement doesn't fit you perfectly. If you think you're better than average, good for you. Not everything written for a broad audience has to be about you; you can move on and read the next comment.
> Why not simply recognize the psychological make-up of people by dealing with them, not by gender or nationality or other statistical probabilities.
I agree with part of this, in that people have wide variation in nature and experience and I want to respect that, not put them in little boxes for my convenience. But there are useful correlations between external appearance and experience, especially where that experience is about how people are treated.
For example, when walking at night in my urban neighborhood, I go well out of my way to give women a lot of space, to not walk too close to them for too long. I'll slow down, pass them, cross the street, get on a different train car, or take an alternate route altogether. Why? Because women are highly likely to have experienced street harassment, stalking, or worse. To them, I'm Shrödinger's Rapist. [2] There's no need for me to make a personal inquiry into their history and psychology, which would be hella creepy and would ruin the effect I'm trying to have, which is just to give them room.
And giving women a different sort of room is what I was arguing for above. Your rant mainly seems to be about things that I didn't say. If you'd like critique some points I actually made, that would be swell, but for now I stand by everything I wrote.
As an aside, you seem to be tacking dangerously close to the shores of "I don't see color", which has a lot of issues. [3]
[1] https://www.google.com/search?q=not+all+men
[2] http://geekfeminism.wikia.com/wiki/Schr%C3%B6dinger's_Rapist
Re: Introducing “Ask a Female Engineer”
#439How active should men be in actually helping to solve the gender diversity problem vs sitting on the sidelines and sharing the work of women who are solving the problem? I've been working on an initiative to encourage more of my male peers to do more to make their organisations more diverse and was recently criticised by a female software engineer who told me that I shouldn't "come into a feminist space" where "women…
The lack of gender diversity in tech is NOT a problem. Women choose not to become software engineers for the same reason they avoid all STEM fields. This recent push to make everyone a software engineer is such an obvious attempt by companies to push down wages. You will be wasting your spare time trying to reduce your salary.
absolutely agree and it is obvious.This is simply about trying to expand the pool of qualified individuals to drive down the salary.
Re: Introducing “Ask a Female Engineer”
#440Earlier quoted context omitted.
Please don't compare nurse, a rather low desired job, and engineering, a rather desired job. If you want to make a comparison, I would pick psychiatrist or veterinarian which both has similar desirability and technical requirements as engineering. Both also have a much worse gender equality ratios that engineering, with a trend going from bad to worse. "Ask a male psychiatrist" would be a interesting idea to push for…
Thanks! Please note though that I am not American and your experience might be a bit different than mine. Around here nurses and engineers have exactly the same number of years in school. A veterinarian is two more years I think. Edit: and you are making things worse by saying that being a nurse is an unattractive job.
When I say nurse is a less desired job, I mean that in the number of student applications and average grade requirements. That is not to say that nurse profession is an unattractive job. It just that all professions are not equally desired, and statistics on student choice and student competition reflects that.
Btw, nurse profession in Sweden is commonly 3 years, which is common for hands on professions like welders, plumbers, painters, musicians, carpenters and so on. Engineering is commonly 4 years, similar to veterinarian. Its the difference between master degree and bachelor's degree.
I do not think its a major leap that professions with master degree requirements is generally considered to be more desired, has generally a higher pay rate, and is generally fought over more harshly. As such, comparing two professions with master degree requirements makes more sense.