Previous related article and discussion: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12338817
So how do we reconcile them?
Loneliness can be depressing, but it may have helped humans survive
31–40 of 46 posts
Re: Loneliness can be depressing, but it may have helped humans survive
#32As if our brains magically emerged from a billion years of evolution with complex mechanisms that did not help us survive... :) I tried (like a good nerd) to reverse engineer all our emotions in my book "The Psychopath Code." Loneliness fell into my group of "Tribal Emotions" (thus evolved to help us form extended families), and here is how I defined it: " Loneliness - the emotion of being disconnected. You feel phys…
Thanks for sharing!
Re: Loneliness can be depressing, but it may have helped humans survive
#33Evolutionary Psychology is like Leibnitizian Optimisim [ https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Best_of_all_possible_worlds ] where God is replaced by evolution. It does nothing to aid in our understanding except to reassure us that everything that is is as it should be. It's essentially an ideology of apathy. Leibnitz's Argument goes like so: >1. God [Evolution] has the idea of infinitely many universes. >2. Only one of thes…
It might be an ideology of apathy if, once finding a plausible evolutionary cause for psychological phenomenon, you cease the investigation. Which you shouldn't. Shutting down a line of inquiry with criticism like this does nothing to aid our understanding either - consider the idea on its merits, as (if you will..) a pure function of its premises.
Re: Loneliness can be depressing, but it may have helped humans survive
#34Earlier quoted context omitted.
narrator is implying that in fact no EP is part of magical thinking, not science. A view that any quick googling will back up as being not terribly controversial actually.
Many people dislike EP intensely (and have attacked its developers, such as Steven Pinker) because they are passionate (I'd say fanatical) believers that culture is what defines us, not biology. So yes, you can find a lot of hate for EP. That doesn't mean much. If you have studied EP or even human nature at all, then you realize quite rapidly that the blank slate proponents (who claim we're born with nothing in our m…
I think everything you want from EP is available in social psychology textbooks like "The Social Animal" by Pratkanis. Unlike EP practitioners the authors actually start out with falsifiable hypothesis and then conduct actual experiments to derive their theories. A lot of people take the results of actual social psychological research and rediscover it with a non-falsifiable EP justification. That's not science, that's just taking scientific observations and reinterpreting them as the will of God or "Evolution" in this case.
Re: Loneliness can be depressing, but it may have helped humans survive
#35Earlier quoted context omitted.
narrator is implying that in fact no EP is part of magical thinking, not science. A view that any quick googling will back up as being not terribly controversial actually.
Many people dislike EP intensely (and have attacked its developers, such as Steven Pinker) because they are passionate (I'd say fanatical) believers that culture is what defines us, not biology. So yes, you can find a lot of hate for EP. That doesn't mean much. If you have studied EP or even human nature at all, then you realize quite rapidly that the blank slate proponents (who claim we're born with nothing in our m…
Well, that's not entirely true (while I do admit the nurture bunch are loud).
Some of us are skeptical on EP's results more than EP itself. I believe that is undeniable that some (or most) behavior is imprinted within our genes, animal domestication being a pretty solid proof.
That doesn't invalidate the fact that most of the time, when I read some study on the field feels more like conjectures made fit in the researcher's beliefs; some flawed logic where the consequent is used to prove the antecedent, and some dubious experiment most of the time made in other species (biological studies on other species don't translate pretty well on humans, and yet, we try the same with a less measurable parameter?) It's even worse if you happen to read some generalist media approach to EP, where EP is used to push down the editor's narrative.
In short, some of us are careful on EP not because it's not a promising field, but because these days is being used to prove everything and it's opposite.
Re: Loneliness can be depressing, but it may have helped humans survive
#36As if our brains magically emerged from a billion years of evolution with complex mechanisms that did not help us survive... :) I tried (like a good nerd) to reverse engineer all our emotions in my book "The Psychopath Code." Loneliness fell into my group of "Tribal Emotions" (thus evolved to help us form extended families), and here is how I defined it: " Loneliness - the emotion of being disconnected. You feel phys…
>Loneliness - the emotion of being disconnected. You feel physical pain in your intestines and chest when you see others enjoying themselves. You sleep lightly and wake often. Your immune system starts to slow and you start to get sick. Your metabolism slows down, yet you eat more often than usual. Your circulation slows, and you feel cold.
Is it some sort of a hyperbole or I really have to hate people and be physically sick to qualify as a lonely person according to psychiatrists?
Re: Loneliness can be depressing, but it may have helped humans survive
#37As if our brains magically emerged from a billion years of evolution with complex mechanisms that did not help us survive... :) I tried (like a good nerd) to reverse engineer all our emotions in my book "The Psychopath Code." Loneliness fell into my group of "Tribal Emotions" (thus evolved to help us form extended families), and here is how I defined it: " Loneliness - the emotion of being disconnected. You feel phys…
>Loneliness - the emotion of being disconnected. You feel physical pain in your intestines and chest when you see others enjoying themselves. You sleep lightly and wake often. Your immune system starts to slow and you start to get sick. Your metabolism slows down, yet you eat more often than usual. Your circulation slows, and you feel cold. Is it some sort of a hyperbole or I really have to hate people and be physica…
It is well known that stress (which doesn't necessitate hating people; in fact, merely feeling lonely will do) weakens immune system.
Re: Loneliness can be depressing, but it may have helped humans survive
#38Earlier quoted context omitted.
>Loneliness - the emotion of being disconnected. You feel physical pain in your intestines and chest when you see others enjoying themselves. You sleep lightly and wake often. Your immune system starts to slow and you start to get sick. Your metabolism slows down, yet you eat more often than usual. Your circulation slows, and you feel cold. Is it some sort of a hyperbole or I really have to hate people and be physica…
It is well known that stress (which doesn't necessitate hating people; in fact, merely feeling lonely will do) weakens immune system. http://www.apa.org/research/action/immune.aspx
That's that, but I'd imagine that "feeling physical pain seeing others enjoying themselves" is something far more serious than just loneliness, maybe I misunderstand the term.
You rise a valid point though, while often being objectively lonely and "disconnected" I seldom felt discomfort about it. That would explain good health marks.
Re: Loneliness can be depressing, but it may have helped humans survive
#39Earlier quoted context omitted.
It is well known that stress (which doesn't necessitate hating people; in fact, merely feeling lonely will do) weakens immune system. http://www.apa.org/research/action/immune.aspx
That's that, but I'd imagine that "feeling physical pain seeing others enjoying themselves" is something far more serious than just loneliness, maybe I misunderstand the term. You rise a valid point though, while often being objectively lonely and "disconnected" I seldom felt discomfort about it. That would explain good health marks.
I took his "feel physical pain in your intestines and chest" to mean, in part, that "sinking feeling in the gut" which is due mainly to the stimulation of the Vagus Nerve[1].
These physical sensations follow the emotion (of loneliness) itself--an affective experience preceding, and triggering, the physical after-effects--which PieterH did not speak much about. I wonder why.
[1] See https://www.reddit.com/r/explainlikeimfive/comments/2bakbc/e...
Re: Loneliness can be depressing, but it may have helped humans survive
#40"3 points by wallflower 1 hour ago " Nothing against the article, but how is this #11 on the frontpage? Did HN make ranking easier recently?
Ranking is relative, so on less busy days (such as today's holiday in the US and Canada) stories with fewer points can be ranked higher than usual. You can always email questions like this to hn@ycombinator.com to avoid cluttering the discussion threads.
Better yet: https://news.ycombinator.com/newsfaq.html