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Loneliness can be depressing, but it may have helped humans survive

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Re: Loneliness can be depressing, but it may have helped humans survive

#21

Post by Aenima »

PieterH wrote: post #4

As if our brains magically emerged from a billion years of evolution with complex mechanisms that did not help us survive... :) I tried (like a good nerd) to reverse engineer all our emotions in my book "The Psychopath Code." Loneliness fell into my group of "Tribal Emotions" (thus evolved to help us form extended families), and here is how I defined it: " Loneliness - the emotion of being disconnected. You feel phys…

I have spent a good part of my morning reading some of your material. Particularly some of your blog articles on hintjens.com. I am very glad I was able to find your content. It is thought provoking to say the least. I hope I will be able to find more content from you in the future. Good luck and thank you.

Re: Loneliness can be depressing, but it may have helped humans survive

#22

Post by olantonan »

PieterH wrote: post #17
Avshalom wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

narrator is implying that in fact no EP is part of magical thinking, not science. A view that any quick googling will back up as being not terribly controversial actually.

Many people dislike EP intensely (and have attacked its developers, such as Steven Pinker) because they are passionate (I'd say fanatical) believers that culture is what defines us, not biology. So yes, you can find a lot of hate for EP. That doesn't mean much. If you have studied EP or even human nature at all, then you realize quite rapidly that the blank slate proponents (who claim we're born with nothing in our m…

> decades of careful documented research and reproducible results, is magical thinking and not science is... hallucinatory.

Right, the same careful research that helps me characterize personality disorders in my day job. You really should stop doing hobbyist research, because The Psychopath Code proves how badly it can end.

Re: Loneliness can be depressing, but it may have helped humans survive

#23

Post by keyboardhitter »

PieterH wrote: post #4

As if our brains magically emerged from a billion years of evolution with complex mechanisms that did not help us survive... :) I tried (like a good nerd) to reverse engineer all our emotions in my book "The Psychopath Code." Loneliness fell into my group of "Tribal Emotions" (thus evolved to help us form extended families), and here is how I defined it: " Loneliness - the emotion of being disconnected. You feel phys…

Just began reading and got sucked in for two hours - great work here, Pieter.

Re: Loneliness can be depressing, but it may have helped humans survive

#24

Post by mkagenius »

sctb wrote: post #3
anexprogrammer wrote: post #2

"3 points by wallflower 1 hour ago " Nothing against the article, but how is this #11 on the frontpage? Did HN make ranking easier recently?

Ranking is relative, so on less busy days (such as today's holiday in the US and Canada) stories with fewer points can be ranked higher than usual. You can always email questions like this to hn@ycombinator.com to avoid cluttering the discussion threads.

> to avoid cluttering the discussion threads.

this part was not that necessary

Re: Loneliness can be depressing, but it may have helped humans survive

#25

Post by pm90 »

rdtsc wrote: post #20
PieterH wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sure, I've written a book "Social Architecture" on this, and many articles. You can read the book freely at https://www.gitbook.com/book/hintjens/social-architecture/de... . It's also in print and Kindle from Amazon. The psychology of collaboration is (in my model, which is of course wrong, just accurate enough to be more useful than ignorance) based on emotions that we've evolved to work together. Most of what I tes…

Thanks writing and sharing those. Very good insights there. Also sorry, didn't recognize your name at first as Pieter Hintjens (I wouldn't have asked as already had the link to the book in my bookmarks). I periodically refer to "The Toolbox" when discussing development practices at work. In professions which are considered more rational and intellectual like programming, there is a danger of discounting the effect of…

This is a good observation. I've seen this happen in work situations multiple times, and I've felt those feelings as well. Which is why one of my life goals is to learn the skill of objective judgement without being influenced by emotions unrelated to the technical merits of a decision.

I believe the correct name for that personality attribute might be 'mature'.

Re: Loneliness can be depressing, but it may have helped humans survive

#26

Post by PieterH »

keyboardhitter wrote: post #23
PieterH wrote: post #4

As if our brains magically emerged from a billion years of evolution with complex mechanisms that did not help us survive... :) I tried (like a good nerd) to reverse engineer all our emotions in my book "The Psychopath Code." Loneliness fell into my group of "Tribal Emotions" (thus evolved to help us form extended families), and here is how I defined it: " Loneliness - the emotion of being disconnected. You feel phys…

Just began reading and got sucked in for two hours - great work here, Pieter.

Yeah, sorry about the sucking in effect... :-) Sometimes I go back and start reading my stuff and get lost for hours again.

Re: Loneliness can be depressing, but it may have helped humans survive

#27

Post by toasterlovin »

olantonan wrote: post #22
PieterH wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Many people dislike EP intensely (and have attacked its developers, such as Steven Pinker) because they are passionate (I'd say fanatical) believers that culture is what defines us, not biology. So yes, you can find a lot of hate for EP. That doesn't mean much. If you have studied EP or even human nature at all, then you realize quite rapidly that the blank slate proponents (who claim we're born with nothing in our m…

> decades of careful documented research and reproducible results, is magical thinking and not science is... hallucinatory. Right, the same careful research that helps me characterize personality disorders in my day job. You really should stop doing hobbyist research, because The Psychopath Code proves how badly it can end.

Can you tell us what's wrong with The Psycopath Code and/or the parent's arguments? I can't tell based on your comment.

Re: Loneliness can be depressing, but it may have helped humans survive

#28

Post by PieterH »

rdtsc wrote: post #20
PieterH wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sure, I've written a book "Social Architecture" on this, and many articles. You can read the book freely at https://www.gitbook.com/book/hintjens/social-architecture/de... . It's also in print and Kindle from Amazon. The psychology of collaboration is (in my model, which is of course wrong, just accurate enough to be more useful than ignorance) based on emotions that we've evolved to work together. Most of what I tes…

Thanks writing and sharing those. Very good insights there. Also sorry, didn't recognize your name at first as Pieter Hintjens (I wouldn't have asked as already had the link to the book in my bookmarks). I periodically refer to "The Toolbox" when discussing development practices at work. In professions which are considered more rational and intellectual like programming, there is a danger of discounting the effect of…

Yes, we tend to discount emotions, our own and others'. It is amazing in retrospect given how important these are in driving us. What I learned with groups was to explicitly ask people, "how do you feel?" and then to insist until I get answers that match what people are showing, rather than saying or claiming.

Especially, "how do you feel about what person X is doing?"

It's not a gender thing or even a nerd thing, really. It's the same with musicians, for instance (I used to jam a lot), they can be really reticent about saying what they actually feel about other people.

Basically our fear of being rejected by the group, and shame at having feelings that no-one else is expressing make us unable to speak up. Since few people can debug their own emotional stacks, the fear and shame dominate, and stop the (e.g.) anger at an asshat messing up the project from coming forwards.

So actually asking people the specific question can change a lot. Mostly, I'll start with "are you enjoying this (the way things are going)?" knowing they'll admit "no" and then we can work it out from there.

Re: Loneliness can be depressing, but it may have helped humans survive

#29

Post by PieterH »

olantonan wrote: post #22
PieterH wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Many people dislike EP intensely (and have attacked its developers, such as Steven Pinker) because they are passionate (I'd say fanatical) believers that culture is what defines us, not biology. So yes, you can find a lot of hate for EP. That doesn't mean much. If you have studied EP or even human nature at all, then you realize quite rapidly that the blank slate proponents (who claim we're born with nothing in our m…

> decades of careful documented research and reproducible results, is magical thinking and not science is... hallucinatory. Right, the same careful research that helps me characterize personality disorders in my day job. You really should stop doing hobbyist research, because The Psychopath Code proves how badly it can end.

It would be really useful to have an actual concrete argument of how and why, rather than vague "your amateurish book proves how bad your book is" statements.

Edit: ah, checked your comment history, you've been trolling for a while HN. Enjoy yourself, it's a weird hobby but hey. Some people like to cook and make music, and other people... they troll.

http://archive.is/5DbNQ

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