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You’re How Old? We’ll Be in Touch

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Re: You’re How Old? We’ll Be in Touch

#151

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Plastic surgery is another option for onsite jobs.

Sadly, there was an article a while back specifically about tech workers doing just that. Might want to lighten up on down voting given the truth of the statement.

Are you referring to this article? https://newrepublic.com/article/117088/silicons-valleys-brut...

Re: You’re How Old? We’ll Be in Touch

#152
post #2

I don't see many old sysadmins in companies I've worked in. Even fewer older developers, I have a slight worry that this career path has an affinity for youth- which I won't have for much longer. So this is disheartening to read.

Of the 3 Linux admins that were above me last decade or so, none are still in the industry. One went into medicine, one went into real estate, and the last I believe became a firearm instructor. None had passion for Linux or sysadmin per se. It was just a job they could get with enough pay and lifestyle (stable location, hours etc) they wanted. When they got older, they simply moved onto different jobs that they thou…

It already is shaping out. It's called "DevOps."

Re: You’re How Old? We’ll Be in Touch

#153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

By that logic people under 30 shouldn't be hired either, because they're more likely to jump ship to another company. TBH, if a single person leaving (for any reason) can tank the company, it's probably doing a person a favor not to hire them. Sounds like a mess.

You are looking at it in black and white terms. Just because there is also a reason younger people might leave unexpectedly doesn't invalidate my assertion. And, having someone leave unexpectedly doesn't have to "tank" the company without still causing damage. Like I said, black and white terms...

Guess I hit a lot of sore spots...

Re: You’re How Old? We’ll Be in Touch

#154
post #111
post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Absolutely nothing wrong with it. But people with families, kids that need help with homework, etc won't be able to do that often if ever. Being young very often also means having fewer commitments.

If you can't play video games with your friend/coworkers from times to times, then your life suck, kids or not.

I'm not a gamer.

Re: You’re How Old? We’ll Be in Touch

#155

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ah, "Grey beard". The term Microsoft used to separate the old from the young at a conference when they first introduced the .NET framework. Classic "old bad, good new" sales. As in, "you Grey Breads remember using C++ and MFC, etc." Yes I remember. Because it was yesterday just before I came to your conference! I still went home and started learning what the hell XML was though. =(

I still can't wrap my head around the fact that we have developers who work on .NET and have never touched either WinForms or WebForms. And I am relatively young.

Not all development involves GUIs. Well, let’s go even further and say most development is not GUI-related.

Business logic and algorithms is what it’s all about.

Re: You’re How Old? We’ll Be in Touch

#156
post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

WebForms can die in a fire, and thankfully has, for the most part, but WinForms is still plenty good enough for cranking out quick and dirty tools. Maybe I'm old, or it's just because I started out in high school doing VB6 forms applications, but I still prefer it unless I have a good reason, over WPF. WinForms is also a pretty thin layer over Win32 controls, as well, so if you have to switch between .Net and native…

WebForms changed the game. ASP was a sub-subset of VB, but WebForms with C# made websites full-scale eventful and stateful programs for the first time. I had never felt such power and freedom programming for the web. Yes, some people would put humongous data structures in view state, and yes, more-better solutions have arisen, but WebForms deserves your respect!

It really doesn’t. I’ve never seen a good WebForms site / app and I’ve always dreaded working with them. They were a regressive step.

Re: You’re How Old? We’ll Be in Touch

#157

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And this is why software today is in such a sad state. Managers think it would be great to have an army of young engineers who don't question and just do what they're told. But any leader surrounded by sycophants will eventually fail. Management often doesn't realize that they really need the senior engineer who has the experience and confidence to say "NO". Because that engineer is the one who will prevent the proje…

> Because that engineer is the one who will prevent the project from collapsing under the weight of scope creep and tech debt. That's the shitty thing: there's enough work that doesn't cross the threshold that requires you to pay for technical debt. Otherwise, a lot more managers would be getting burned by it. There's no electric shock when they hit the wrong button. Even if it isn't a "big boom" moment where you can…

There's not really a single threshold though. I think the shittier thing is that software is just an incredible market for lemons. Even us programmers ourselves don't really know how good we are, and there is no way to accurately compare all the problems we faced with the problems we avoided. So forget about non-technical management, they could be paying twice as much for someone who takes 10x as long to deliver a feature and never have the first hope of getting a clue. Or they could hire someone who is demonstrably fast but paints the whole system into a corner where the next critical business feature requires a complete rewrite.

Experience is no silver bullet, but it generally goes a lot further than non-technical tea-leaf-reading or junior dev shotgun programming.

Re: You’re How Old? We’ll Be in Touch

#158
post #2

I don't see many old sysadmins in companies I've worked in. Even fewer older developers, I have a slight worry that this career path has an affinity for youth- which I won't have for much longer. So this is disheartening to read.

Just so you know, i am a young apprentice in an IT department. The official average age of developpers here is 41... I can count the employees under 30 in my two hands. Could probably even count the one under 35...

So the opposite exists too...

Re: You’re How Old? We’ll Be in Touch

#159
post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That depends on what country you're in. In Japan it's very standard to include date of birth, gender and a photograph on CV's. On the whole I hate the practice, but you have to consider cultural norms when doing the job-hunting dance.

It's also customary in Germany, although I've never had a problem getting a job and I've never attached a photo to my resume.

It's quite customary in Getmany to even have a picture on your CV.

Re: You’re How Old? We’ll Be in Touch

#160
post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That depends on what country you're in. In Japan it's very standard to include date of birth, gender and a photograph on CV's. On the whole I hate the practice, but you have to consider cultural norms when doing the job-hunting dance.

It's also customary in Germany, although I've never had a problem getting a job and I've never attached a photo to my resume.

Not really anymore, the latest version of the DIN norm on CVs has no photo or birthdate anymore, and in some states, it’s being discussed to ban it even.
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