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Why Electric Cars Will Be Here Sooner Than You Think

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Re: Why Electric Cars Will Be Here Sooner Than You Think

#101

Post by outworlder »

expression wrote: post #87
sitharus wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

However, a gasoline powered car also takes engine oil and transmission fluid if it's an automatic. It will also require regular servicing of the engine and eventual replacement of worn seals etc. If the fuel cost per mile is the same the electric car could still be cheaper. I can't say how much though, because that depends on the servicing cost per year vs the battery replacement cost and that depends on your local s…

Luckily you don't need to maintain electric cars at all.

You do. But keep in mind they have way less parts, moving or otherwise. Spark plugs, cables, the entire engine cooling system, fuel pumps, all of that is missing.

It boils down to: battery (big unknown, but seem to be holding up surprisingly well), engine (incredibly simple!), no transmission or a very simple one (Nissan Leaf has a single gear), inverter, charger, brakes, and the standard 12V battery you find in all cars (which doesn't have to drive a starter motor, so should last longer).

Re: Why Electric Cars Will Be Here Sooner Than You Think

#102

Post by sremani »

rob74 wrote: post #100

So, a plug-in hybrid will be lugging around a gas engine and (probably full) gas tank which it won't be needing for 90% of all trips. Am I the only one who thinks this is terribly inefficient?

This purist talking point infuriates me, but aren't you lugging those 50kw battery when you are not traveling 200 miles and only 30 miles. PHEVs are not your enemy. I see the criticism and some of it is fair, but most of it is not.

Re: Why Electric Cars Will Be Here Sooner Than You Think

#103

Post by outworlder »

Scea91 wrote: post #76
drzaiusapelord wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's on top of the added cost of an electric vehicle. Worse, how does it handle the Chicago winter? I'll be running the heater 6 months out of the year, which is a drain on the battery, but on a ICE-based car, it just uses excess heat with no cost on fuel. So its tough to figure out what my real cost per mile will be in the winter. I think TCO is going to be difficult to calculate for many people, especially when y…

Doesn't the electromotor also produce excess heat that can be used in a similar way?

It does, but it's a matter of 80% efficiency. Not enough to heat up the cabin.

Not that it matters for a Tesla though. A Leaf feels the effects of running the heater more.

Re: Why Electric Cars Will Be Here Sooner Than You Think

#104

Post by outworlder »

honkhonkpants wrote: post #13
hyperbovine wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Gas is what 2 minutes? Depends quite a lot on where you are. There are 12 gas stations south of 96th St. in Manhattan. SF will have lost 40% of the service stations it had 10 years ago as of 2017. Boston, same. The gas station at Divisadero and Fell has what looks like a 20 minute wait at all times. This is all due to real estate prices. Getting gas in affluent coastal metropolises is not a pleasant experience. Not…

20 minutes is still 30x faster than charging. And how many charging stations do you think there are south of 96th street?

No it's not. 20 is all one needs for DC quick charging.

Re: Why Electric Cars Will Be Here Sooner Than You Think

#106

Post by privateersman »

rob74 wrote: post #100

So, a plug-in hybrid will be lugging around a gas engine and (probably full) gas tank which it won't be needing for 90% of all trips. Am I the only one who thinks this is terribly inefficient?

There's lots of different hybrids out there. You can get buses that only use the electric part when moving from a stop. In that case, you get the main advantage of electric (torque) and then combustion takes over for normal running conditions. I think something like that is more sensible.

Re: Why Electric Cars Will Be Here Sooner Than You Think

#107

Post by _asummers »

tempestn wrote: post #58
sremani wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The battery decay is going to be gradual, even though noticeable in a Model S, given its huge battery, it would still be a drivable vehicle even if it loses 50% of the battery capacity. So that 14-20K expenditure will not kick in till 15 years or so with a patient owner, which is pretty much lifetime of many cars in US.

And in 15 years the batteries will inevitably be much less expensive than they are today.

And hopefully much more powerful, extending THAT purchase even further.

Re: Why Electric Cars Will Be Here Sooner Than You Think

#108

Post by dennyis »

outworlder wrote: post #101
expression wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Luckily you don't need to maintain electric cars at all.

You do. But keep in mind they have way less parts, moving or otherwise. Spark plugs, cables, the entire engine cooling system, fuel pumps, all of that is missing. It boils down to: battery (big unknown, but seem to be holding up surprisingly well), engine (incredibly simple!), no transmission or a very simple one (Nissan Leaf has a single gear), inverter, charger, brakes, and the standard 12V battery you find in all…

FYI Generally an electric "engine" is referred to as a motor.

Re: Why Electric Cars Will Be Here Sooner Than You Think

#109

Post by lorenzhs »

outworlder wrote: post #101
expression wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Luckily you don't need to maintain electric cars at all.

You do. But keep in mind they have way less parts, moving or otherwise. Spark plugs, cables, the entire engine cooling system, fuel pumps, all of that is missing. It boils down to: battery (big unknown, but seem to be holding up surprisingly well), engine (incredibly simple!), no transmission or a very simple one (Nissan Leaf has a single gear), inverter, charger, brakes, and the standard 12V battery you find in all…

Battery cooling is also a factor that you shouldn't ignore

Re: Why Electric Cars Will Be Here Sooner Than You Think

#110

Post by m3500 »

Spooky23 wrote: post #35
kylec wrote: post #17

I was talking to my father a few weeks ago about electric cars, and I wanted to quantify how much going electric would save him so I ran some numbers. Where he lives gas is currently somewhere around $2.20/gallon. His car gets around 30mpg combined, so he's paying ~$0.073/mile. Tesla's website contains a "charging estimator" for the Model S, which estimates a cost of $12.04 for a total charge of 300 miles in a 90D. I…

I disagree. Fuel is only one part of a car's cost. The capital expense, maintenance and insurance are other costs. You pay a really high premium for electrics. If you insist on buying a new car, the TCO of a Honda Fit or similar car will be lower than an electric, and you avoid whatever bullshit that you need to deal with from the vendor (i.e. Using the dealer for all repairs) and dealing with charging stations and c…

To wit: the 12V battery in a prius (the one that fills much the same role as the battery in a gas-only car) "repaired" at the dealer, using OEM parts, in 2016, is pushing $300

this post is from 2012, OEM battery was $235 at the time:

http://www.priusonline.com/242-prius-battery-charging/20810-...

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