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A Powerful Russian Weapon: The Spread of False Stories

nytimes.com

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Re: A Powerful Russian Weapon: The Spread of False Stories

#13
Also http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2016/08/06/how-russia-...

That story is pretty extreme, but I (yes, an anon account on a random website) can confirm much of this is true based on some reasonable in-depth network analysis.

Take a look at the Incirlik story on twitter https://twitter.com/search?q=Incirlik and note the weird patten many have of reposting thing like emergency response accounts in between pro-Trump messages, and weird conspiracy theories (although [1]).

(Throwaway for various reasons)

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poe%27s_law

Re: A Powerful Russian Weapon: The Spread of False Stories

#14
post #2

That is one one-sided anti-propaganda-propaganda piece. Let's not pretend that any government does not do the same to others, eh?

Nor should we accept false equivalencies.

It isn't even necessary here. The "propaganda" the article opens with can be rephrased as this: some people in the Swedish government wanted something controversial, and social media i.e. their citizens talking to each other reflected the usual mishmash of true, half true and not true things people often believe about more or less anything controversial.

However, because this time the controversial thing was to do with NATO, it's obviously all the Russian's fault. They have no evidence, and nobody is willing to put their name to such a claim (it's all "analysts"), but no matter, it's definitely the Russians.

Besides, whose word do we have that these beliefs were false? The defence minister!

From the WSJ we learn this: "Swedish lawmakers formally backed an agreement Wednesday that allows the North Atlantic Treaty Organization to more easily operate on Swedish territory during training or in the event of a conflict or other crisis."

http://www.wsj.com/articles/sweden-ratifies-nato-cooperation...

That doesn't sound so very different from the supposedly false claim that "NATO could attack Russia from Sweden without government approval". thelocal.se says:

"Originally signed in September 2014, the HNSA with Nato would allow the alliance to transport helicopters, aircraft and ships across Swedish territory, but only upon Sweden’s invitation.

As the agreement involves changes to Swedish law in order to give Nato personnel privileges and immunities with regards to areas like tax and custom rules, it required parliamentary ratification."

http://www.thelocal.se/20160525/sweden-votes-yes-to-controve...

It's only a tiny step from that description (NATO soldiers have immunity from some areas of law) to the one apparently circulating (NATO soldiers have immunity in some other areas). Does this really require the invocation of Russian propaganda, or the Facebook telephone game sufficient?

Re: A Powerful Russian Weapon: The Spread of False Stories

#17
post #2

That is one one-sided anti-propaganda-propaganda piece. Let's not pretend that any government does not do the same to others, eh?

Ah, typical whataboutism. Because the Russian propaganda is so extreme in distorting the truth, everyone else must do the same. Reminds me of people who compare the political movements they don't like to ISIS, because "both are bad".

Re: A Powerful Russian Weapon: The Spread of False Stories

#18
I use a simple method to recognize Putin's propagandists:

Ask if someone is willing to condemn Putin for doing similar invasions as Hitler did in the 1930s.

If the only answers you get to that question are personal attacks and attacks on USA, the person writing is probably working in St Petersburg and paid to write things on the internet.

Edit: 1. I am not American "pabloski", at least get the unserious personal attacks correct. 2. USA generally don't annex territory, unlike Hitler and Putin.

Edit 2: I would ask "pabloski" if he was willing to condemn modern invasions and theft of area in Europe, but it isn't really needed, after he behaved just like I described and he even gave an rt-link.

Re: A Powerful Russian Weapon: The Spread of False Stories

#19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nor should we accept false equivalencies.

It isn't even necessary here. The "propaganda" the article opens with can be rephrased as this: some people in the Swedish government wanted something controversial, and social media i.e. their citizens talking to each other reflected the usual mishmash of true, half true and not true things people often believe about more or less anything controversial. However, because this time the controversial thing was to do wi…

After the Crimea takeover, the Swedish internet was filled with comments with very, very bad Swedish who defended Putin. There were some articles that interviewed the people in St Petersburg employed to write these comments.

The main difference with the Putin supporters today is that the Swedish language is excellent....

(And for a fact -- even in the ex communist party, few Swedes support starting wars in Europe again, in 1930s style. There are obviously lots of Putin propaganda online.)

Edit: Thanks, rbanffy. I saw a Swedish copy and others: http://www.dn.se/nyheter/varlden/de-ar-putins-soldater-pa-na...

Re: A Powerful Russian Weapon: The Spread of False Stories

#20
post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It isn't even necessary here. The "propaganda" the article opens with can be rephrased as this: some people in the Swedish government wanted something controversial, and social media i.e. their citizens talking to each other reflected the usual mishmash of true, half true and not true things people often believe about more or less anything controversial. However, because this time the controversial thing was to do wi…

After the Crimea takeover, the Swedish internet was filled with comments with very, very bad Swedish who defended Putin. There were some articles that interviewed the people in St Petersburg employed to write these comments. The main difference with the Putin supporters today is that the Swedish language is excellent.... (And for a fact -- even in the ex communist party, few Swedes support starting wars in Europe aga…

This may be the article you referred to https://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/apr/02/putin-kremlin-...
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