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Uber's Failure in Japan

disruptingjapan.com

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Re: Uber's Failure in Japan

#21

Post by ixtli »

2bitencryption wrote: post #14
jsnathan wrote: post #3

The article basically states that Uber's cavalier attitude towards the law was the wrong approach to use in Japan, because the Japanese public does not respect this attitude, and that they should have worked it out with regulators before they started operations. I guess the broader lesson implied is that you need to put in the effort to understand the local culture, and adapt your strategies accordingly, before you t…

That and, having taken taxis in Japan... they're honestly very decent. Much better than the taxis I've taken elsewhere. Partly because the roads are less congested, even in the heart of Tokyo, since so many take the train. I never found myself wishing I could take an Uber in Japan -- a taxi was always there when I needed it... and that was only if I wasn't near a train station, which was almost never.

This is basically it. Japan is a very service-oriented country. People take pride in how well they interact with customers from book stores to restaurants to taxis. This interaction assumes a certain level of honesty and it really changes how you interact when you exchange money with someone for something.

Re: Uber's Failure in Japan

#22

Post by todd8 »

ben_jones wrote: post #17
blisse wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Really? I find that most people think it's the other way around, that Uber and AirBnB represent the democratic will of the people, challenging broken systems that the people do not endorse now that a better idea is available. At least, that's how it looks over in USA/Canada.

I've always dislike the idea that "people vote with their dollars" because theirs no way people "voted" that all their dollars go to a 1% of individuals, who strictly speaking are rarely model or even popular citizens (.i.e. the Walton family).

I'm missing your point. In the example of Walmart, individuals chose to take there business there, enriching the Walton family at the expense of other merchants. While literally not voting for the Walton family to receive their business, a large number of individuals did make the choice of doing business with the Walton family didn't they?

Re: Uber's Failure in Japan

#23

Post by toomanybeersies »

dasil003 wrote: post #5

Better title would be "How Uber's Failure in Japan Can Help Multinational Corporate Expansions Everywhere". It's a bit of a stretch to still call Uber a startup, and even if you grant that, these lessons are not for startups. I happen to have co-founded a multi-national startup. The best advice I have for going multi-national as a startup is don't.

The company I work for is technically multinational (only 2 countries right now)

If you're a SAAS company, why no go multinational? I guess with MUBI you'd have hoops to jump through re: licencing though?

Re: Uber's Failure in Japan

#24

Post by pnathan »

The advantage of Uber has nothing to do with price and everything to do with grotesque incompetence on the part of the taxi operators.

Five-six years ago, when I asked for a receipt for an expense report, I got a hand-scribbled note. Running credit cards often required hand-based crank mechanisms. Autoplaying TV on the back of a seat that was billed unless you explicitly opted out. It was, in short, a scammy operation designed to squeeze you in all the impolite ways, and there was nothing you could do about it. When Uber/Lyft came on the scene, it took the scam out of the taxi industry and transformed the situation into one where you had a clear understanding of the price, where you could get a clear and reasonable receipt (emailed, even!), where you could pay with a card. You get a clear idea of how long the operator will take to arrive.

I had to use a taxi in St Louis, MO last summer. In order to do this I had to call the taxi company. No app, no website, nothing. It took 45 minutes to show up, period. The driver couldn't find me when he got near. I am very glad I did not miss my flight. It reminded me again of how deeply I support the "ride-sharing" services.

I consider the taxicab operations to be corrupt and effectively incompetent, frequently propped up by asinine medallion systems and graft at the city level. Therefore, I refuse to use taxis if Lyft or Uber are available. I will NOT intentionally contribute one red cent to these jokers.

Now, all of what the author said about Uber's flouting of the law is true. And that's not something I'm terribly happy about. But I think there's a certain value in simply ignoring bad law and fixing it on the fly. Might be the American in me, but so it goes.

In any case: if the taxi industry in Japan is honest, competent and well executed, Uber/Lyft will not have the profound advantage it has over the taxi industry in the US.

Re: Uber's Failure in Japan

#25

Post by ajmurmann »

2bitencryption wrote: post #14
jsnathan wrote: post #3

The article basically states that Uber's cavalier attitude towards the law was the wrong approach to use in Japan, because the Japanese public does not respect this attitude, and that they should have worked it out with regulators before they started operations. I guess the broader lesson implied is that you need to put in the effort to understand the local culture, and adapt your strategies accordingly, before you t…

That and, having taken taxis in Japan... they're honestly very decent. Much better than the taxis I've taken elsewhere. Partly because the roads are less congested, even in the heart of Tokyo, since so many take the train. I never found myself wishing I could take an Uber in Japan -- a taxi was always there when I needed it... and that was only if I wasn't near a train station, which was almost never.

The biggest culture shock coming back to the bay area from a long Japan vacation was the taxi from the airport to a nearby hotel. The day before out return we had a driver in Tokyo who had approached it hotel from the wrong direction and had to drive around the block to get us to the front entrance. We were happy to walk half a block but he was very embarrassed and insisted to drive us to the front door and took way more off the charge than seemed reasonable and refused extra money we wanted to pay. Needless to say the car was immaculate. The taxi at SFO was filthy and the driver got grumpy as soon a we told him that we were going to a nearby hotel. He ignored both the directions from his navigation system which he claimed was broken as well as our instructions and kept missing roads leading to the hotel that he claimed he couldn't find despite it being in sight and us telling him where it is. When I protested and told him that I'm concerned about having to pay higher charges because of his obvious mistakes he insured me to not worry that he would take that off the charge. When we arrived at the hotel he took less than 10% off and got rude and insulting when I protested. Bottom line: I would not hesitate to take Japanese taxi any time even over an uber black. I can't wait for the SF taxi industry to completely collapse.

Edit: There is a flip side to this though. In Japan it was obvious to me that people take pride in their work. Even people who drove taxis out clean train stations. The resulting quality of work was astonishing. However, I also got the impression that these people are give respect for their good work. I don't think many taxi drivers in the US respect their own work and society for sure doesn't make them feel respected. Respect seems to be much tighter coupled to monetary success and I can't say I'm free from that.

Re: Uber's Failure in Japan

#26

Post by jiqiren »

This whole argument doesn't work when you consider AirBNB. AirBNB is thriving in Japan with the same Uber playbook.

The real reason for Uber's failure is public transit and taxis in Japan are amazing (and for a decent price).

Re: Uber's Failure in Japan

#27

Post by hkmurakami »

pnathan wrote: post #24

The advantage of Uber has nothing to do with price and everything to do with grotesque incompetence on the part of the taxi operators. Five-six years ago, when I asked for a receipt for an expense report, I got a hand-scribbled note. Running credit cards often required hand-based crank mechanisms. Autoplaying TV on the back of a seat that was billed unless you explicitly opted out. It was, in short, a scammy operatio…

>if the taxi industry in Japan is honest, competent and well executed

I've used Taxis in Japan across the country for 20+ years, can attest to its quality, reliability, and professionalism. It's on the expensive side, with rides usually starting at 700 yen (roughly 7USD) [1], but the drivers are courteous professionals who drive smoothly and know their cities and routes cold (if they don't, they'll apologize for not knowing and ask you for directions).

The only downside is that sometimes the drivers are cigarette smokers. While they won't smoke inside the car, the odor can be very noticeable.

[1] I believe this will be reduced to 500 yen soon.

Re: Uber's Failure in Japan

#28

Post by greggman »

pnathan wrote: post #24

The advantage of Uber has nothing to do with price and everything to do with grotesque incompetence on the part of the taxi operators. Five-six years ago, when I asked for a receipt for an expense report, I got a hand-scribbled note. Running credit cards often required hand-based crank mechanisms. Autoplaying TV on the back of a seat that was billed unless you explicitly opted out. It was, in short, a scammy operatio…

I feel your pain. That's what taxi service has been like for me in SF and LA. Also it was effectively non-existent except for calling to be taken to the airport because there were so few.

Japan, or at least the populated parts generally have tons of taxis so they are easy to find. They are polite and very clean, one thing western cabs are not. If they do something wrong (go the wrong way, end up taking the wrong road) more often than not they'll refund a portion of the fare without asking. I've had this happen a few times a year over the last 20 years.

Singapore is similar. Tons of cabs. In fact in Singapore you could book cabs in an app / online since like 2009. You get told the number of your cab so when lots of cabs are driving up you know yours is #27B-6. I had similarly nice experiences. I tried to tip a driver $3 for a $7 fare just so I could give him a $10 and he was like "too much lah!" and gave me $2 back.

I don't know how Uber is doing in Singapore but my understanding is not well. It's higher priced than local cabs for one.

My point being I agree with you. It's totally the taxis fault for providing sub-par service. In places where that's not the case Uber is having difficulty.

I suppose there's also the issue of car ownership though. For Uber to work you need people who own cars and are willing to drive them. Places like Tokyo and Singapore where most people don't own cars would probably make it harder to find drivers. I guess NYC has people from outside to drive in?

Re: Uber's Failure in Japan

#29

Post by greggman »

jsnathan wrote: post #3

The article basically states that Uber's cavalier attitude towards the law was the wrong approach to use in Japan, because the Japanese public does not respect this attitude, and that they should have worked it out with regulators before they started operations. I guess the broader lesson implied is that you need to put in the effort to understand the local culture, and adapt your strategies accordingly, before you t…

I'm not sure that argument really holds up. AirBnB is very popular in Japan (hosting not renting), tons of listings, all of them are breaking the law. (most of them are lying about their listings as well with AirBnB's blessings)

Re: Uber's Failure in Japan

#30

Post by privateersman »

pnathan wrote: post #24

The advantage of Uber has nothing to do with price and everything to do with grotesque incompetence on the part of the taxi operators. Five-six years ago, when I asked for a receipt for an expense report, I got a hand-scribbled note. Running credit cards often required hand-based crank mechanisms. Autoplaying TV on the back of a seat that was billed unless you explicitly opted out. It was, in short, a scammy operatio…

I guess that's why I don't understand the hype.

In many countries Uber is just another taxi brand, one that's licensed by the local authorities. The only thing it has going for it is the app, but all their competitors have apps too. Plus, I've never had to use an app - I just call an automated number, press one digit and a taxi arrives at my door within a few minutes. If I'm using a mobile phone then the operator answers.

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