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The Difference Between AI, Machine Learning, and Deep Learning

blogs.nvidia.com

91–100 of 107 posts

Re: The Difference Between AI, Machine Learning, and Deep Learning

#91
post #28
post #12

Also, an interesting read related to this would 'the AI effect'[0]. A lot of the stuff Deep Learning/Machine Learning is able to do today would be looked at as something that only 'true' AI (whatever consensus on what that means is; I think of it as AGI) would be able to do. But as soon as we are able to solve a problem that we think (feel?) only true AI (AGI) would be able to solve, as soon as we know how it was sol…

What if we trained a CNN to "know [it] knows nothing"? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/I_know_that_I_know_nothing

You might have to see someone who took philosophy and a Machine Learning researcher about that :)

Re: The Difference Between AI, Machine Learning, and Deep Learning

#92
post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> My cellphone can play hundreds of games well, I don't think that's an indicator of intelligence. I don't think it is either. I'd want to see many more domains than is demonstrated in playing most games (e.g. conversation, object recognition, planning, maths)

That's not really my point. If software X can do handwriting recognition then having software Y call software X is usually fairly easy and has little to do with intelligence. IMO, we already have intelligent AI. It's just not intelligent the way we are used to dealing with. People don't want AI, they want a human brain in a box.

Some of these functions are easy to compose to get something impressive, true. But that is not often the case. Take the case for games and imagine we wanted a meta-algorithm to select an algorithm to apply to each game. The intelligence would then shift into, how does one select the correct algorithm for the current game in the shortest time possible?

There was a recent blog post covering this and the difficulties involved:

http://togelius.blogspot.ca/2016/08/algorithms-that-select-w...

I also posted a link (https://arxiv.org/pdf/1604.00289v2.pdf) above which is an easily readable exposition on just how current approaches fall short. It's nothing so trivial as "it's just not what we're used to".

Re: The Difference Between AI, Machine Learning, and Deep Learning

#93
post #12

Also, an interesting read related to this would 'the AI effect'[0]. A lot of the stuff Deep Learning/Machine Learning is able to do today would be looked at as something that only 'true' AI (whatever consensus on what that means is; I think of it as AGI) would be able to do. But as soon as we are able to solve a problem that we think (feel?) only true AI (AGI) would be able to solve, as soon as we know how it was sol…

>But as soon as we are able to solve a problem that we think (feel?) only true AI (AGI) would be able to solve, as soon as we know how it was solved, it is no longer a mystery that warrants amazement and we argue that it is not real intelligence, just like the link below states. Well, the problem here is that we keep expecting " real intelligence" to have magical properties: we expect intelligence to be a way of crea…

>Well, the problem here is that we keep expecting "real intelligence" to have magical properties: we expect intelligence to be a way of creating new and interesting thoughts

I think we might have to step into borderline philosophical subjects like epistemology and sentience depending on who you talk to to define intelligence and whether you're the free will group or determinism group and so on.

I think you might agree with the statement that we can't yet come to a strict definition of what intelligence is, and once we have it, if we are going for intelligence or something more akin to stuff independent of intelligence like sentience and creative thought.

I'm personally in the determinist group and agree that there is nothing inherently magical about intelligence, just us being simpletons who cannot comprehend how a microprocessor works when you just give the latest intel chip. It is so complex that we need a lot of time and energy to comprehend it, but like the intel chip, I believe there is a design aspect to the human brain rather than it being a magical black box.

The problem is, the majority of us are the simpletons and have a long way to go before we have the knowledge that the intel chip makers have.

I apologize for the bad intel chip analogy, I probably could've come up with something better :)

Re: The Difference Between AI, Machine Learning, and Deep Learning

#94
post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> once we have a comprehensive AI program that can play many kinds of games Before AlphaGo, DeepMind released a reinforcement learning algorithm that could play many Atari games just from the raw pixels on the screen, in many games surpassing humans. The same algorithm. https://arxiv.org/pdf/1312.5602.pdf Reinforcement learning is a general framework for learning behavior from acting in an environment with the purpos…

> Reinforcement learning is a general framework for learning behavior from acting in an environment with the purpose to maximize a reward. It can be used, and was used, in multiple domains. AlphaGo used RL as well. > Also, regarding other tasks: a neural net that recognizes cats can be easily made to recognize dogs too. A program that translates English to French can be made to translate other languages too. I'm awar…

>I don't think anyone would call an algorithm that in theory can apply to lots of domains intelligent. You need a concrete implementation to demonstrate this

How will not applying the same technique/algorithm to lots of domains disqualify from being intelligent? RL and CNNs are being applied in many domains today. Is the complexity of the algorithm is what you're disagreeing with?

The human brain (if you strip out stuff that does not pertain to intelligence) can be seen as one super complex machine which can be encoded. We just don't know all the algorithm/code yet.

Very interesting how both your opinions differ. I had a similar discussion with someone on HN a while ago about this exact same thing. The discussion was very inferior to this one but you might be interested nevertheless I hope.

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11939866

The other opinion I was referring to was argonaut's.

Re: The Difference Between AI, Machine Learning, and Deep Learning

#95
post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Reinforcement learning is a general framework for learning behavior from acting in an environment with the purpose to maximize a reward. It can be used, and was used, in multiple domains. AlphaGo used RL as well. > Also, regarding other tasks: a neural net that recognizes cats can be easily made to recognize dogs too. A program that translates English to French can be made to translate other languages too. I'm awar…

>I don't think anyone would call an algorithm that in theory can apply to lots of domains intelligent. You need a concrete implementation to demonstrate this How will not applying the same technique/algorithm to lots of domains disqualify from being intelligent? RL and CNNs are being applied in many domains today. Is the complexity of the algorithm is what you're disagreeing with? The human brain (if you strip out st…

Hmm, I think we're misunderstanding each other. Is your view that RL and CNN have been or can be applied to create a machine you'd call intelligent right now?

My original comment was about how people shift the goal posts about what AI is. My opinion is that in the same way you'd struggle to call a human intelligent if literally all they could do was play genius level Go, most people would not call a computer program intelligent if all it could do was play Go.

If the machine could play many other games and adapt to games it hasn't seen before that's more convincing, but you would expect an intelligent machine to be able to adapt to more varied tasks as well (e.g. having conversations, writing stories, doing maths, recognising objects). Right now, we have AIs that are genius level at one task that cannot even attempt other tasks e.g. genius level at Chess or even a whole category of games but couldn't have a basic conversation.

> How will not applying the same technique/algorithm to lots of domains disqualify from being intelligent? RL and CNNs are being applied in many domains today. Is the complexity of the algorithm is what you're disagreeing with?

I'd say it's not important if it's one algorithm, many algorithms, simple algorithms or complex algorithms, just that it's a single general purpose concrete implementation that is capable of doing many varied tasks and learning.

> The human brain (if you strip out stuff that does not pertain to intelligence) can be seen as one super complex machine which can be encoded. We just don't know all the algorithm/code yet.

Yeah, I don't think there's anything magical about the brain that a computer couldn't replicate in some form.

Re: The Difference Between AI, Machine Learning, and Deep Learning

#96
post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> My cellphone can play hundreds of games well, I don't think that's an indicator of intelligence. I don't think it is either. I'd want to see many more domains than is demonstrated in playing most games (e.g. conversation, object recognition, planning, maths)

That's not really my point. If software X can do handwriting recognition then having software Y call software X is usually fairly easy and has little to do with intelligence. IMO, we already have intelligent AI. It's just not intelligent the way we are used to dealing with. People don't want AI, they want a human brain in a box.

> That's not really my point. If software X can do handwriting recognition then having software Y call software X is usually fairly easy and has little to do with intelligence.

Ah, I understand you now. I don't see the relevance though as I don't see why it's important how many algorithms, programs and computers is used to implement the AI. I imagine your cellphone is unable to do many things a regular human can do such as hold a basic conversion and learn to play new games which is why I wouldn't call it intelligent.

Re: The Difference Between AI, Machine Learning, and Deep Learning

#97
post #45

There's that one iconic image of neurons suspended in space with bolts of electricity flashing between them. We are told that's how our brains work. We are then shown a diagram by a computer scientist. Instead of cells and thunder, we see circles and arrows. Then we are told there is an algorithm that simulates what the brain does. Viola, we have our artificial neural network. Not only do they look similar, they have…

Actual neural network papers are far removed from the impressions you get from popular science articles. Biological neurons were some inspiration for the abstraction, but the underlying model is more a direct evolution of the maths/stastical models. Griping that DNNs are not actually like neurons is akin to saying that Object Oriented programming is nothing like the organisation of biological cells it was inspired on…

Exactly. Wikipedia is full of disclaimers about the differences also. The issue is just with word usage that continues to fuse the two, where is reality any direct correlation ended ages ago.

Re: The Difference Between AI, Machine Learning, and Deep Learning

#98
post #27
post #12

Also, an interesting read related to this would 'the AI effect'[0]. A lot of the stuff Deep Learning/Machine Learning is able to do today would be looked at as something that only 'true' AI (whatever consensus on what that means is; I think of it as AGI) would be able to do. But as soon as we are able to solve a problem that we think (feel?) only true AI (AGI) would be able to solve, as soon as we know how it was sol…

If it's magic, it's AI; if it's understood, it's algorithms.

Couldn't this be said about anything magical though?

If it's magic, it's human intelligence. If it's magic, it's consciousness. If it's understood, it's algorithms.

It's only a matter of time. There is no magic in science. Only in the application of it.

Re: The Difference Between AI, Machine Learning, and Deep Learning

#99
post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I hear this repeated a lot. But I've never actually seen a source from, say, the 90's or the 2000s, actually saying something like "if we're able to classify images better than humans, that's true AI." I suspect it's just hearsay that's been repeated over and over again.

In the 90's, John McCarthy was calling Go "the new Drosophila of AI". Now, we have AlphaGo that is "just" a bunch of "generic" deep learning with MC. Maybe John McCarthy was right and the ideas behind AlphaGo are the first steps toward true AI. I am very impressed.

Is this supposed to disprove my point? The fruit flies of AI hardly sounds impressive.

Re: The Difference Between AI, Machine Learning, and Deep Learning

#100
post #53
post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In the 90's, John McCarthy was calling Go "the new Drosophila of AI". Now, we have AlphaGo that is "just" a bunch of "generic" deep learning with MC. Maybe John McCarthy was right and the ideas behind AlphaGo are the first steps toward true AI. I am very impressed.

The guys at NVIDIA did something very cool recently. They took a simple CNN (convolutional neural net) and in 2-3 days they taught it to drive a car. Article: How Our Deep Learning Tech Taught a Car to Drive - https://blogs.nvidia.com/blog/2016/05/06/self-driving-cars-3... These neural nets are really smart, and we don't know exactly how they work, we know only in principle. But if we asked the guy who made the self…

Did you read the paper? They did not teach it to drive a car. The car just does lane keeping - it doesn't even do turns or lane changes. This is stuff solved 10+ years ago. And even then it only achieves 98% autonomy on lane keeping - this is a task that needs 100% accuracy. You should not be running into the median every couple miles.
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