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Ask HN: What is the future of back-end development?

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31–40 of 164 posts

Re: Ask HN: What is the future of back-end development?

#31
post #19

Given the complex services we already have, services that access complex, multi-source databases of the relational and NoSQL kind, I find it amusing that UI developers are so unaware of the complexities of the back end--complexities that are normally hidden from them--that they think they can be reduced to so many calls. WebSockets don't magically assemble complex back-end data. Amusing in the extreme.

It's the classic "Can't you just add another checkbox here?" situation. Yes, I can add a checkbox there. But I have to add the code to include that setting in the API that the front-end calls, to give you a way to retrieve it and change it. Then I have to add code to the data access layer for this new setting. Then I have to write the SQL scripts to add columns/tables for this new setting, as well as change scripts t…

Sounds like your framework sucks. With an orm and some sort of json serialization that's literally just:

Put bagel in toaster.

Update the db model.

Add a migration.

Update the viewmodel db model translation in relevant requests.

Get bagel and butter it.

Commit.

Test the migration on a staging db if feeling paranoid, cause it's just adding a column.

Push to master.

Update production.

Take last bite of bagel.

If you aren't also doing the frontend, tell the guy who is to check out the updated swagger docs.

Re: Ask HN: What is the future of back-end development?

#32

I had this long rant, then I deleted it because I realized I misunderstood you. Another attempt: The vast majority of compute will live in the datacenter for the next 30 years bc quantum computers require superconductivity. That compute will become like a common utility and will most certainly be used to power the APIs that consumer electronics call. The P2P adds unnecessary complexity when client/server, a simpler s…

[deleted]

Re: Ask HN: What is the future of back-end development?

#33
post #5

WebAssembly will not revolutionize anything. It's like java where people claim it's as fast as native code, and yet every single program runs like a dog and takes 100 times the resources. Only worse because it runs in a browser.

Well hopefully WebAssembly will fix the 20% CPU util to scroll on some websites because of the insane amount of JS

Re: Ask HN: What is the future of back-end development?

#34
post #9

The ability to build a solid backend platform and infrastructure is going to be increasingly important in the future. The "backend" is becoming increasingly anonymous (as in not seen, not as in privacy), but it has never been more important. If nothing else the increasing focus on data collection and processing will push the need for custom backend forward for many years. Any every application that needs to store or…

I don't think custom backends are going away either, I do think it will become way less prevalent then it is today though, similarly how all programs used to do manual memory management, this hasn't gone away but most programmers now rely on garbage collection. So much of backend work is redundant, login, user info management, allowing the creation of groups of users, user following, user data uploading or sharing. N…

With react native and electron web stack is running in circles.

How many times should this be repeated: web stack is easier to write only if you don't know shit of the native SDKs. Otherwise it does not even compare.

Re: Ask HN: What is the future of back-end development?

#35

Personally I don't see any of that happening - client-side app development on the web is a chaotic mess with no "official" (whatever that means) way of doing things. Throw into that mix the constant reinvention thats going on (yeah can't wait to see everything get re-invented AGAIN when web-assembly comes along), for what constitute incredibly marginal gains in the UI space (the web UI was already way fast enough 5 y…

Agreed. As I once put it web stack for the apps is like trying to invent, version after version, a kind of fork which is most suitable to eat soup. Folks, the spoon exists for the reason.

Re: Ask HN: What is the future of back-end development?

#36
post #9

The ability to build a solid backend platform and infrastructure is going to be increasingly important in the future. The "backend" is becoming increasingly anonymous (as in not seen, not as in privacy), but it has never been more important. If nothing else the increasing focus on data collection and processing will push the need for custom backend forward for many years. Any every application that needs to store or…

I don't think custom backends are going away either, I do think it will become way less prevalent then it is today though, similarly how all programs used to do manual memory management, this hasn't gone away but most programmers now rely on garbage collection. So much of backend work is redundant, login, user info management, allowing the creation of groups of users, user following, user data uploading or sharing. N…

>So much of backend work is redundant

True, but that's been the case for 10 or 15 years now. Most of the applications we develop are just CRUD applications... with a twist.

There seems to always be some detail that prevents you from having a generic backend. I mean look at something like SAP. It's an off the self application, it pretty much contains everything you'd imagine needing for running a large business. Yet every single installation is customized like you wouldn't believe.

Most of the stuff you mention isn't making the backend go away, it just makes it a little easier to implement and run. Just throwing EVERYTHING into a Hadoop cluster seems... careless. You'd still need to validate that whatever the client sent is actually any good. Otherwise you're potentially polluting your data. I don't believe in client side validation as something that provides any kind of usefulness, beyond giving helpful hints to the user.

Re: Ask HN: What is the future of back-end development?

#37

- More "reactive" frameworks / languages / tools. - More functional principles and more resilient implementations. - Complete decoupling from lower levels. Meaning that you don't care about servers anymore. Apps are Dockerized and resources are dedicated automatically. - No more human designed APIs. Why write APIs if modern machine learning principles can replace the whole concept? - More lambda / serverless concepts…

It's funny how future is described by many with what's hot that day. If you were to ask similar question ten years ago, the future would looks so wildly different (iPhone was announced in 2007).

Re: Ask HN: What is the future of back-end development?

#38
post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's the classic "Can't you just add another checkbox here?" situation. Yes, I can add a checkbox there. But I have to add the code to include that setting in the API that the front-end calls, to give you a way to retrieve it and change it. Then I have to add code to the data access layer for this new setting. Then I have to write the SQL scripts to add columns/tables for this new setting, as well as change scripts t…

Sounds like your framework sucks. With an orm and some sort of json serialization that's literally just: Put bagel in toaster. Update the db model. Add a migration. Update the viewmodel db model translation in relevant requests. Get bagel and butter it. Commit. Test the migration on a staging db if feeling paranoid, cause it's just adding a column. Push to master. Update production. Take last bite of bagel. If you ar…

Our framework does kind of suck...

We're also not doing the common website/webapp thing, but rather on-premise enterprise software. So we have to update installers too, and be relatively paranoid about updates, because it is intensely painful when we have a bad update with one of our customers.

Re: Ask HN: What is the future of back-end development?

#39

I don't think WebAssembly is going to revolutionize front end development. What you can do with WebAssembly regarding front-end development is running your Qt/GTK+ type of programs on web. But noone is interested in that. As a matter of fact, current trend seems to be ditching that sort of program on desktops and using HTML/JS/CSS stack for desktops as well (atom, slack, etc) because its much easier to create a top-n…

  > It evolves at a fast pace.
It REvolves at a fast pace. In place.

Re: Ask HN: What is the future of back-end development?

#40
post #21

Some people don't like the word much, but "serverless" is going to become a bigger deal. You'll write your code, complex or simple; you'll hand it off to some cloud system; you'll write a bit of configuration; you're done. Likely the configuration part will become less and less required. You won't think about hardware, scaling, load balancing, etc, it will just happen for you. The data store being used will be abstra…

I agree in part. However, it reminds me of the prediction that front end development would be replaced by point and click build environments. While that suffices for a section of the market, it has very far from killed it off.
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