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How to Have Healthy Relationships as a Developer

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Re: How to Have Healthy Relationships as a Developer

#111

Post by NotAMouse »

msvalkon wrote: post #107
ceit wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

User name xkcd-sucks. Not a fan of coding for fun. Hackathons? Have you ever just wanted to write a web scraper in a new language to see how it is different from your usual? Never coded a small video game? Why are you a programmer then?

I'm a programmer because I enjoy it, my employer seems to value the results and I am relatively well compensated for my time. We should really make an effort to try to accommodate the people in the programming profession who do not want to spend their free time coding on projects. Programming is very, very enjoyable (to me), but I have a family with which I want to spend as much time as possible. Do I want to write a…

I don't think we should accommodate anybody with the handle 'xkcd-sucks', much less anybody so flippantly derisive of people who do code because they like to code.

Re: How to Have Healthy Relationships as a Developer

#112

Post by Philipp__ »

aninhumer wrote: post #103
Philipp__ wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think everybody got the point. The dude was writting blog about keeping healthy social life, not sexuality. If we keep splitting it to atoms, it would be pretty distracting experience for writter of any blog post. Being a little bit inclusive doesn't cost much, but it could cost a lot if you go by your logic for every other thing...

If you get used to writing in inclusive terms, these changes don't cost anything. They're just how you naturally express ideas, and exclusive terms feel unnaturally specific.

After giving it a second thought you are right. But what struck me about initial comment was that I read the blog post first, which I think was pretty straight forward, just to find out that somebody was giving shit to OP for not including something that wasn't even remotley close to the subject. Statistics are what's holding the whole thing back. I have friends that are gay and I am totally open minded about anything, but sincerely I would forget to include them If I was writing blog post like this. Not because I don't like them or anything but because I would be telling experiences from my perspective, trying to tell a story from my point of view, and I am white male clique. So I will pay attention and work on that, but sometimes those things are not the point and you don't think about it...

Re: How to Have Healthy Relationships as a Developer

#113

Post by TheCapn »

ceit wrote: post #102
xkcd-sucks wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>In fact, you pretty much have to program in your free time in order to keep up with all the new paradigms and frameworks Lol no. If I'm coding it's not free time, and if I'm coding to learn it's professional development, not recreation. "Coding is a lifestyle" is such a scam.

User name xkcd-sucks. Not a fan of coding for fun. Hackathons? Have you ever just wanted to write a web scraper in a new language to see how it is different from your usual? Never coded a small video game? Why are you a programmer then?

Do you ever find yourself interacting with a carpenter and asking him why he doesn't build additions to his house, or his friend's homes in his free time?

What about an accountant? Ever quiz them or deride them for not going out of their way to balance budgets and crunch numbers for family & friends?

Why is programming this anomaly to people where there's a necessity for you to want to spend your personal hours doing what you do for 40 hours a week (or more for many) professionally? If you don't make your life entirely centered around your career you're obviously not a real programmer despite many people having lives outside their career still being extremely talented and successful.

I think it's a lie we tell ourselves and perpetuate. People who sold their lives to programming expect to surround themselves with others who've done the same. You end up on the hiring side of an interview and you want the candidates to have a portfolio of personal projects to show off because that's what shows dedication. I get along best with the coworkers I have that have a wide variety of interests because they're not a bore to talk to and get a beer with. Jobs in the middle of nowhere are far more tolerable with those who you can stand to be cramped in a room with for two weeks rather than the guy who can only relate with RocketLeague anecdotes.

Re: How to Have Healthy Relationships as a Developer

#114

Post by [deleted] »

jdminhbg wrote: post #22

> Talk About Your Work I strongly disagree with this one, although I'm not sure if my reasoning is broadly or only personally applicable. The last thing I want to do at the end of a long day of work is recap what I did. Even in the best-case scenario of a day full of victories, it's just exhausting to try to relive all of them with the added burden of explaining the decade-plus knowledge base you'd need to understand…

[deleted]

Re: How to Have Healthy Relationships as a Developer

#115

Post by retro64 »

pikachu_is_cool wrote: post #25
mratzloff wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At this point, the only "hobby" I have is programming. I don't even know what else I like anymore. Well, that's on you, but the good news is that you can change that as soon as you want. Why not start today?

I've been trying for the past 6 months, but I keep coming back to programming. Old habits die hard.

It is also good to acknowledge to yourself, who you are, and stop looking around at others, feeling guilty and making excuses. If you want to code 12 - 18 hours a day, and you are not neglecting other responsibilities, then go for it. Don’t apologize to yourself that you aren’t into biking, marital arts, cooking, or skydiving.

I’m speaking to myself, BTW. I have spent a good portion of my life of explaining it to others and questioning it myself. I started programming in the 80’s though, and I had to fight through a wall of people with the mindset that computers were inherently “evil” and treated with high suspicion because they were not commonly understood. Yes, I grew up in a backwater.

Re: How to Have Healthy Relationships as a Developer

#116

Post by TheCapn »

amelius wrote: post #87
dasboth wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Try going analogue, find a hobby that doesn't involve a computer (music, cooking, hiking etc.). I find if I do even a small amount of a few different activities in a day, it feels a lot more full . A day spent coding, then going home to cook dinner and read a book always feel better than a day spent coding, then going home to browse the internet or even work on a coding side project (if I get around to those, they're…

> Try going analogue, find a hobby that doesn't involve a computer (music, cooking, hiking etc.) I would suggest to find a hobby that involves other people.

I would too. But that doesn't mean you can't take up a hobby that is done alone but shared with a club. I got into car work and joined my local auto club. We do meets, drives, and grab beers every once in a while and share experiences or things we've done. EDIT: Not to mention the social point of "I fucked up, who knows what they're doing and wants to share a case and fix this mess"

I've been hired by a few friends-of-friends to build automation and although the coding and electrical is done at my little workstation there's a local maker group that I like to share my works with.

I always recommend picking up a hobby that has tangible products. Gaming and Reading are all mind exercises. Doing something with your hands helps work the body and when you've worked at something for long enough its much more visual for how you've honed your craft. Its a different type of reward than coding is. I don't know if I can describe the feeling it gives but it's different somehow, and it's a good feeling to look down upon a physical creation with pride.

Re: How to Have Healthy Relationships as a Developer

#117

Post by xkcd-sucks »

ceit wrote: post #102
xkcd-sucks wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>In fact, you pretty much have to program in your free time in order to keep up with all the new paradigms and frameworks Lol no. If I'm coding it's not free time, and if I'm coding to learn it's professional development, not recreation. "Coding is a lifestyle" is such a scam.

User name xkcd-sucks. Not a fan of coding for fun. Hackathons? Have you ever just wanted to write a web scraper in a new language to see how it is different from your usual? Never coded a small video game? Why are you a programmer then?

>Hackathons? Have you ever just wanted to write a web scraper in a new language to see how it is different

That stuff can be as fulfilling as cleaning the house/having sex/shooting guns/dancing but it's only happening on company time-- Especially when the terms of my contract essentially give my company ownership of anything I write. Also, 8-12h per day of any one activity is enough

Re: How to Have Healthy Relationships as a Developer

#118

Post by thanatropism »

LPT though: have friends at work but don't flirt with them.

I had a really good friend at work for a while but it always had this flirty undercurrent. We both had SOs, but enjoyed the "office wife/husband" thing (my real wife actually knew about it and was not jealous). Anyway, the flirtationship thing makes you as vulnerable to criticism as an actual relationship, so the occasional sarcastic tirade or bad mood day really hurts. Long story short, we're not only no-longer-friends (this happen, I've worked at the same place for so long some friendships are cyclical); we can't talk to each other or work in the same open plan office. It's a small wonder no one's been fired. Ultimately the drama/good feeling ratio doesn't work out.

Re: How to Have Healthy Relationships as a Developer

#119

Post by binarycrusader »

karlmcguire wrote: post #95
owenversteeg wrote: post #70

Personally, I don't think that having healthy relationships as a developer is much different than having healthy relationships as anyone else. As with any other technical job, it can be hard to explain exactly what your job is, but a bit of humor and an ELI5-style explanation goes a long way. One thing specific to programmers is the ability to whip up a little program to help people. Someone spends an hour every day…

Author here, I agree to an extent. As I said in the "Spend Time With Them" section, a lot of developers also program as their hobby. In fact, you pretty much have to program in your free time in order to keep up with all the new paradigms and frameworks. Jobs that have been around a lot longer, like construction or accounting, allow you to just leave your work when you go home. In that way I think developers face a u…

Almost any crafting profession involves practice outside of work; for example: painting, photography, sculpting, etc.

I also suspect many academic professions fall into this trap as well: mathematician, physicist, etc.

As a developer myself, I don't think this particular aspect is unique, instead I think it's a matter of perspective and what we value in life.

For example, many individuals if they see someone reading a phone as they're walking may look unfavourably upon them thinking something like "people glued to their phones, bleargh". However, if the same individual was walking reading a paper book instead, many would simply shrug it off as "that person is a studious individual / bookworm".

Re: How to Have Healthy Relationships as a Developer

#120

Post by sanderjd »

NotAMouse wrote: post #111
msvalkon wrote: post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm a programmer because I enjoy it, my employer seems to value the results and I am relatively well compensated for my time. We should really make an effort to try to accommodate the people in the programming profession who do not want to spend their free time coding on projects. Programming is very, very enjoyable (to me), but I have a family with which I want to spend as much time as possible. Do I want to write a…

I don't think we should accommodate anybody with the handle 'xkcd-sucks', much less anybody so flippantly derisive of people who do code because they like to code.

They weren't derisive of people who like to code, they were simply pushing back against the idea that you must do it as a lifestyle rather than just a profession. I love xkcd (and that username is clearly just trolling people who wrap up too much of their identity in the things they like), program for fun sometimes, and love to read computer science books for fun, but I completely agree with the sentiment that the common view that programming must be your lifestyle in order to thrive in the industry is unfortunate and problematic.
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