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Why I'm not a big fan of Scrum

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Re: Why I'm not a big fan of Scrum

#41

Post by stevesun21 »

humanrebar wrote: post #18
stevesun21 wrote: post #12

After I read this complain-based article, my only question for this author is what's your fix/suggestion? Otherwise, I don't get what the point of this guy write this article.

Describing drawbacks and problems is value added. Theoretical physicists regularly know about problems for decades before solutions are found. Precisely describing the problem can get the intelligent diaspora organized around finding improvements to the situation.

Did you just compare a project management methodology with theoretical physics? Sounds to me like you try to compare apple with orange. Sorry, I don't follow you.

Re: Why I'm not a big fan of Scrum

#42

Post by crdoconnor »

cechner wrote: post #2

Scrum proponents (a label I would tentatively apply to myself) would tell you that 'you're doing it wrong' but unfortunately a point-by-point reply to this article would detract from the general problem here: Scrum is intended to be the straightest line towards measuring your real progress on a project, and not much else If youre working on a project where it is important that you have as-accurate-as-is-realistic an…

>Scrum is not opinionated about the actual development methodology so claims about how it affects the code that is written are themselves a bad smell IMO.

Pretty much every kind of deadline driven development ramps up technical debt. Scrum certainly isn't the worst in this respect (developers make their own deadlines, and conscientious ones will build the time in), but the emphasis on commitment and the pressure to deliver at the end of the sprint puts pressure on developers to cut corners.

The worst part though, is that the product owner is usually non-technical and will deprioritize stories to clean up technical debt as a result.

IMO for any kind of development methodology to work it must have an opinion on technical debt. Scrum doesn't.

Re: Why I'm not a big fan of Scrum

#43

Post by Meegul »

dudifordMann wrote: post #30

I agree that there are individuals and companies who have defined such ridged structure and expectation into their Scrum method that they can no longer be considered an agile approach missing two of the key purposes of agile approaches: * Individuals and interactions over processes and tools * Responding to change over following a plan Now, I cannot say that Scum abstractly is a bad approach to attempting to be more…

His complaint about the standups interrupting productive work rings a bell with me though. I see no reason why a daily status update over the general channel on slack doesn't serve the same purpose as a standup meeting. In fact, make it so there's a loose timeframe, say 30 minutes, and you wouldn't be interrupting people, nor forcing them to stare at a wall.

My team hasn't tried anything like that, but I think it could really be useful. It encourages better communication throughout the day as well, as it gets people using Slack. Plus, it gives managers the ability to keep track of what people say each day.

Re: Why I'm not a big fan of Scrum

#44

Post by davnicwil »

humanrebar wrote: post #18
stevesun21 wrote: post #12

After I read this complain-based article, my only question for this author is what's your fix/suggestion? Otherwise, I don't get what the point of this guy write this article.

Describing drawbacks and problems is value added. Theoretical physicists regularly know about problems for decades before solutions are found. Precisely describing the problem can get the intelligent diaspora organized around finding improvements to the situation.

Yes, thank you. The attitude of 'you may not describe a problem without already having prepared specific, actionable solutions to it' is limiting and only really appropriate in situations where time comes at a very high premium generally, i.e. meetings and such, or the value of actually solving the problem is too low wrt time spent coming up with solutions.

In almost every other situation, writing articles on the internet included, simply describing perceived problems so that you and others may consider solutions to them immediately or at a later time is extremely valuable, and is a necessary (but insufficient) condition of progress being made.

Re: Why I'm not a big fan of Scrum

#45

Post by humanrebar »

camtarn wrote: post #33

Quoting a nice idea from the article: "One way to achieve this might be putting work items through what I would call an algebra of complexity, i.e. an analysis of the sources of complexity in a work item and how they combine to create delays. The team could then study the backlog to locate the compositions that cause the most work and stress, and solve these knots to improve the codebase. The backlog would then resem…

> tracking accuracy of estimated time versus actual time elapsed (deeply uncomfortable but very useful!)

It should only be uncomfortable if the team means 'commitments' when they say 'estimates'.

This is part of the reason stories are generally pointed with (more or less) triangular numbers. So that teams stop fretting about missing estimates by an order of magnitude or less.

Re: Why I'm not a big fan of Scrum

#46

Post by blub »

maxxxxx wrote: post #22
cageface wrote: post #7

I've been doing Scrum-driven development for a few years now after working much more independently for most of my career. I understand why managers like it because it at least lends some structure and predictability to what is an inherently unpredictable enterprise. But the author's criticisms of the incentives of Scrum are on point I think. Because the stories are always articulated in terms of user facing features…

In my view the only way to handle this is to make constant refactoring part of the work without telling management. If you ask for permission for refactoring you will almost always get a "No".

Why is management getting involved?

The PO should try to balance this with feature impementation and the team + SM should make it clear when it's needed. This seems to work fine in an environment based on collaboration between PO,SM and dev team, but will probably fail in an adversarial one.

Re: Why I'm not a big fan of Scrum

#47

Post by UK-AL »

crdoconnor wrote: post #42
cechner wrote: post #2

Scrum proponents (a label I would tentatively apply to myself) would tell you that 'you're doing it wrong' but unfortunately a point-by-point reply to this article would detract from the general problem here: Scrum is intended to be the straightest line towards measuring your real progress on a project, and not much else If youre working on a project where it is important that you have as-accurate-as-is-realistic an…

>Scrum is not opinionated about the actual development methodology so claims about how it affects the code that is written are themselves a bad smell IMO. Pretty much every kind of deadline driven development ramps up technical debt. Scrum certainly isn't the worst in this respect (developers make their own deadlines, and conscientious ones will build the time in), but the emphasis on commitment and the pressure to d…

Sprints are meant to be based on the previous sprints velocity, so any commitment should get smaller and smaller until you can do it without forcing it.

Re: Why I'm not a big fan of Scrum

#48

Post by hidro »

I like how Scrum promotes transparency and trains each individual to become self-managed (or at least getting better at it). But it often feels like it's being hyped up, with many people getting obsessed over its practices/rituals.

Estimating work is a nice idea, but using 'story points' for it just feels like a bad API decision - I have never seen a new Scrum team member (including me) getting it at 1st try.

And maybe it's just me, but having a full time, dedicated Scrum Master, who serves solely as a facilitator (without having any actual role in product delivery) is a nightmare, especially for teams that are used to Scrum practices.

Re: Why I'm not a big fan of Scrum

#49

Post by taneq »

tomelders wrote: post #26
cageface wrote: post #7

I've been doing Scrum-driven development for a few years now after working much more independently for most of my career. I understand why managers like it because it at least lends some structure and predictability to what is an inherently unpredictable enterprise. But the author's criticisms of the incentives of Scrum are on point I think. Because the stories are always articulated in terms of user facing features…

I leave my current role in just under two weeks for the very reason you describe. I'm tired of being the "difficult dev" that everyone has grown to hate. Let them launch. Let it fail. Let's see who the arsehole is then.

You, because the moment you leave you become that-guy-who-we-can-safely-blame.

Mostly joking but plenty of places do work like that.

Re: Why I'm not a big fan of Scrum

#50

Post by humanrebar »

Meegul wrote: post #43
dudifordMann wrote: post #30

I agree that there are individuals and companies who have defined such ridged structure and expectation into their Scrum method that they can no longer be considered an agile approach missing two of the key purposes of agile approaches: * Individuals and interactions over processes and tools * Responding to change over following a plan Now, I cannot say that Scum abstractly is a bad approach to attempting to be more…

His complaint about the standups interrupting productive work rings a bell with me though. I see no reason why a daily status update over the general channel on slack doesn't serve the same purpose as a standup meeting. In fact, make it so there's a loose timeframe, say 30 minutes, and you wouldn't be interrupting people, nor forcing them to stare at a wall. My team hasn't tried anything like that, but I think it cou…

> I see no reason why a daily status update over the general channel on slack doesn't serve the same purpose as a standup meeting.

I haven't used slack in anger. When you need help, how do you tell the difference between a teammate being busy, unavailable, or just too distracted to respond? Part of the point of the in-person standup is to remove ambiguities about this at least once a day.

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