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When It Comes to China, Google’s Experience Still Says It All

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Re: When It Comes to China, Google’s Experience Still Says It All

#171

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Talk about believing propaganda. You're falling for Chinese propaganda hook, line, and sinker. Broad Sustainable Building Group is basically one giant propaganda machine propped up by government loans. They've been talking about building the world's tallest building in only 90 days for years, but they recently dropped the idea because it was never a serious proposal . Buildings of this height need rigidity from huge…

>They've been talking about building the world's tallest building for years in only 90 days, I didn't say they built the tallest building in the world. They built a 54 story buildings and five story buildings are certainly realistic. >A US company could also put up a 40 story building in 2 weeks. If the government loaned them hundreds of millions of dollars, allowed them to ignore worker safety and environmental laws…

>Different systems, and they seem to have some advantages.

Of course there are advantages to planned economies. In the 60s, the US was absolutely terrified that the Russian command economy gave them overwhelming advantages that we couldn't compete with.

And If you went to school in the early 90s you'll remember that there was a real fear that we'd have to start going to school on Saturdays to keep up with the Japanese.

I can almost guarantee that in about 30 years, we'll have a panic about India.

>I didn't say they built the tallest building in the world. They built a 54 story buildings and five story buildings are certainly realistic.

Never said you did. My argument is that the company is essentially a propaganda machine, as evidenced by their repeated claims (and failed attempts) that they are going to build the world's tallest building.

>The whole "they cheat" meme is part of every criticism of China.

I'm not making a moral argument about China. I'm telling you the reason that they can accomplish many of the things that they are accomplishing is because they aren't restricted by the same rules.

They can have cheap factories because they don't have strong labor laws, and they don't have strict emissions controls.

The thing is though, all of that will end as their standard of living increases. It's already happening. People are tired of living in smog, so they are introducing stricter emission controls. People aren't living like rural peasants anymore so they are demanding higher wages.

As these things happen, growth will slow. Sure they're GDP will eclipse ours one day, so will India's most likely, but it's going to take a lot longer than naive extrapolation predicts it will.

Re: When It Comes to China, Google’s Experience Still Says It All

#172
post #136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Don't forget the USA's ace in the hole for brewing civil unrest in other countries: Hollywood. (I'm being mordant here; not advocating for international psy-ops.) American media project a depiction of life that is very attractive by design, and this raises expectations among consumers of this media. If Chinese people were not aware of the lifestyles of westerners, the Chinese government would be under less pressure t…

Then again, Hollywood is now increasingly dependent on China, increasingly tailors film to the Chinese market and cultural demands, and is taking more and more financing from China: https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2016/jul/21/words-... http://fortune.com/hollywood-film-financing/ https://next.ft.com/content/2cb93908-2c65-11e6-bf8d-26294ad5...

Few films (34) can be shown in China each year so being selected is a thing which some go for and others ignore. http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/china-film-import-quot...

Re: When It Comes to China, Google’s Experience Still Says It All

#173

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I just saw the new Star Wars -- cofinanced by (e:) Alibaba films. In it, one of the moral cruxes of the main story was that the crew needed 'Unity'. I saw this as a subtle shift from american 'Freedom'. There's a point where some 'good guys' are being held prisoner. In any red-blooded American Hollywood Film, this would lead to 'GIVE US OUR FREEDOM' type resistance. In this movie, it led to 'WE NEED UNITY' resistance…

Do you by any chance mean Star Trek and Alibaba films?

Thank you. I haven't seen the new Star Trek movie, but I have seen the new Star Wars movie so I was so very confused.

Re: When It Comes to China, Google’s Experience Still Says It All

#174

Earlier quoted context omitted.

TSMC have two 16nm fabs and are building a 10nm fab.

Taiwan is not China. Where in China is TSMC building cutting edge semiconductor fab?

The Republic of China is not recognised by the UN. It is no more a state than Transnistria or South Ossetia.

Re: When It Comes to China, Google’s Experience Still Says It All

#175
A few important segments that really seem to get buried in the rest of the text.

"This is not to say that Chinese government regulation drove Uber’s deal with Didi, which was clobbering Uber in the ride-sharing market; in fact, Uber felt it was treated fairly by a government interested in transportation innovation. According to reports on the ground, Didi used its local knowledge to act more nimbly in satisfying Chinese customers.

...

Google’s retreat came in 2010, so it’s fair to ask whether those regulatory issues still exist.

...

To be fair, the American marketplace has not exactly been a fertile ground for Chinese internet companies hoping to break in. Though many of the really big players — Baidu, Alibaba, TenCent, WeChat — have moved on from clone-ish beginnings and actually come up with important innovations, none have made an impact here. But that’s due more to a lack of resolve than any regulatory barriers."

Re: When It Comes to China, Google’s Experience Still Says It All

#176

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why is it a problem if China develops a higher GDP than the US. Its not a problem for the people. It might be a problem to politicians that want to tell a story, but wishing china to do worse economically is truly backwards. If china comes out with better technology than the us, better products and services, cheaper and all that, the whole world gets better. If you dont believe that, then you must for the sake of con…

China is repressive and has very low standards for human rights. If China becomes more powerful they may decide to conquer the US properly. This may be along way off but this is the fear that's behind not wanting China to surpass the US economically.

Chinese civilization is different from western civilization, specially in its habit to absorb other culture, instead of conquering them. China had a Mongol dynasty, a Manchu dynasty. But it never rode to the other side of the world to force remote populations to change their religion or political system.

Re: When It Comes to China, Google’s Experience Still Says It All

#177
post #7

The West and China are playing a global chess game and have been for some time. An impoverished China was not in the West's interests and so they agreed to buy all kinds of lowish tech Chinese made goods. In return most jurisdictions enforced a balance of trade with China, with the exception of the US. On their end China insisted on joint ventures and technology transfer to the extent Western companies would comply.…

Relevant: http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2015-07-09/u-s-impose...

'“Economically counterproductive tariffs have artificially made solar panel prices in the U.S. the most expensive in the world,” Shah said. CASE was formed to represent most of the U.S. solar industry against the petition.

Solarworld AG, a German company with a factory in Oregon, persuaded the Commerce Department in 2012 to apply tariffs on imports of solar cells from China.'

Re: When It Comes to China, Google’s Experience Still Says It All

#178

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you by any chance mean Star Trek and Alibaba films?

Yes, thank you for pointing that out, edited my post. e: Augh, I missed changing the Star Wars -> Star Trek edit and now I can't edit; I have permanently lost nerd cred for making that mixup ;_;

May the force live long and prosper with you :)

Re: When It Comes to China, Google’s Experience Still Says It All

#179
Don't kid yourself thinking that the US is above those tactics. They might use some other techniques but it is in many regards just as protectionist as China.

One common theme is completely exaggerated fines leveled against foreign companies. Look at the banks: while doing very little to punish U.S. banks (if you take net transfers into account) who where without a doubt the main culprits in the sub-prime crisis and thereby causing a global financial crisis, the U.S. almost exclusively punished foreign banks - and with that also foreign tax payers - for wrong doings like dealings with countries the U.S. dislikes, etc..

Another striking example is the fines imposed in Volkswagen. While it certainly was immensely stupid to cheat on the emission test, the fines are completely over the top: $16b and counting. After every state and agency is through with VW, it might be $30b or more. At the same time, U.S. car companies that caused actual casualties with there shoddy engineering are left of the hook with a slap in the wrist.

Some sources:

http://www.forbes.com/sites/timworstall/2014/12/22/isnt-it-s...

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/09/29/business/dealbook/volkswag...

Re: When It Comes to China, Google’s Experience Still Says It All

#180

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why is it a problem if China develops a higher GDP than the US. Its not a problem for the people. It might be a problem to politicians that want to tell a story, but wishing china to do worse economically is truly backwards. If china comes out with better technology than the us, better products and services, cheaper and all that, the whole world gets better. If you dont believe that, then you must for the sake of con…

China is repressive and has very low standards for human rights. If China becomes more powerful they may decide to conquer the US properly. This may be along way off but this is the fear that's behind not wanting China to surpass the US economically.

What do you think of the U.S.'s record for human rights? To be fair, the U.S. has done a much better job of keeping many of those incidents (Gitmo or elsewhere) secret until fairly recently.
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