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The end of sprawl

washingtonpost.com

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Re: The end of sprawl

#31

Post by p4wnc6 »

danking00 wrote: post #23
greggman wrote: post #16

I'm curious how certain things fit into city living. Examples: Rockband the Game. You can't play that game in an apartment in the city without being a total dick to your neighbors. You can play it in a house in suburbia. Arguably the same is true for the home version of Dance Dance Revolution Another is room scale VR which pretty seems to demand owning a large enough place to have your VR room. Maybe some people can…

I wonder what type of cities you've lived in. I've lived in various parts of Boston, Cambridge, and Somerville and we've previously had rock band and currently have room scale VR (it is, in fact, in use as I write this). Neither had dedicated rooms but the setup and tear down is manageable. Neighbors never complains about the noise, but we also don't set the bass to room-shaking levels. Perhaps the most significant d…

When living in Boston/Cambridge between 2008 and 2015, every apartment I lived in had serious noise issues, and it wasn't just being able to hear too much from neighboring apartments ... it was also hearing people blast music out of their open windows from other buildings or in shared parking areas.

Reporting these noise violations never did anything. The police showed up, asked people to stop, they stopped for 30 minutes then just started up again.

After months and months of this at two totally different apartments, I finally just stopped reporting the egregious noise violations, because what's the use? Probably some disruptively loud neighbor started thinking what you thought -- that if no one is actively complaining then it must be OK, when really it was just worse: the mechanism of complaining doesn't actually help solve the problem so it's of no use.

It's especially bad in older buildings that have been converted into apartments -- which represents a lot of the inventory in Cambridge and Somerville.

Edit: Forgot to add -- city construction noise is also a huge problem, and most cities have specific laws about how much noise construction crews can make and at what times. Inside the permitted limits (even if the limits are actually unreasonable from a human health and well-being point of view) you have no recourse of any kind.

For instance, I usually go on very long runs on Friday nights -- it's one of my weekly exercise and meditation habits. So I tend to sleep in on Saturdays to let my body recover. Being woken up by jackhammers at 9 am on every Saturday for an entire summer was a very miserable experience for me.

Re: The end of sprawl

#32

Post by p4wnc6 »

The main thing I am looking for is privacy. I find that if I have access to private property big enough to take a short walk in nature, maybe a 10-20 minute walk, then my physical and cognitive health improves by huge amounts.

When I lived in urban Boston, and I would go for long runs on the street and through parks, or I would use a rental car to go out to the Middlesex Fells for geocaching, it was like a poor bastardization of what I needed. There were always people around. I could not get into a meditative mood and access any of the cognitively rejuvenating effects that the activities were for.

It saddens me very much that human culture is moving to agglomerative cities, because I believe I am personally extremely maladapted to be able to handle that, so I constantly feel like I'm being squeezed and stressed, even just by my ambient environment, even on a pleasant sunny day when I just take a walk to relax.

It's a very maddening way to live, but I have not found any solution that would let me live with a better compromise that allows me to have private access to nature on my own property and still successfully interface with the industries I work in.

Re: The end of sprawl

#33

Post by EliRivers »

sotojuan wrote: post #6
Houshalter wrote: post #2

I think sprawl will increase when self driving cars become a thing. Long commutes will be a lot more tolerable, parking a non issue, and the cost of owning a car could be reduced with self driving taxis or busses.

Unless the self driving cars can make an hour commute be half an hour or less, they'll still suck. All you gain is the ability to read, eat, play games, or even sleep during the commute and no one will be comfortable doing that for a few years.

I currently take the train. My door to door is the same as it would be if I drove, to within a few minutes. I choose to take the train because I can read, and so I can sometimes drink alcohol. I've been doing this for almost three years.

In my previous job, taking the train was a longer journey door to door (40 minutes compared to about 25, or 18 minutes once when I wanted to see how fast I could do it and didn't care about jumping the grass embankment to get off the motorway at the motorway service station). I probably took the train about two-thirds of the time, and drove the remainder. Had that job for about four years.

I am but one data point, but I see a lot of other people on the train doing the same thing.

Re: The end of sprawl

#35

Post by Symbiote »

atom-morgan wrote: post #22
greggman wrote: post #16

I'm curious how certain things fit into city living. Examples: Rockband the Game. You can't play that game in an apartment in the city without being a total dick to your neighbors. You can play it in a house in suburbia. Arguably the same is true for the home version of Dance Dance Revolution Another is room scale VR which pretty seems to demand owning a large enough place to have your VR room. Maybe some people can…

To provide a better example, I used to play drums. As much as I'd like to continue practicing, I can't in an apartment complex even if I were to buy an electric kit. The tapping on the pedal would be too much for the people who live below me. This problem, combined with the insane amount of people moving to Atlanta, has me thinking about moving.

I suspect it's not common in the US, but my apartment is directly above a shop. I can stamp on the floor as much as I like in the evenings and on Sundays, since the shop is empty.

You could try raising the drum kit off the floor: http://www.alesisdrummer.com/index.php?topic=4068.0

Re: The end of sprawl

#36

Post by cableshaft »

matt_morgan wrote: post #34

Where does the idea that you should spend 30% of your money on rent come from? I see it everywhere. Not that I'm questioning it in general, but does it ever change?

I see 25% a little more often than I see 30%, but it's not that much different of a percentage.

Re: The end of sprawl

#37

Post by CM30 »

Houshalter wrote: post #2

I think sprawl will increase when self driving cars become a thing. Long commutes will be a lot more tolerable, parking a non issue, and the cost of owning a car could be reduced with self driving taxis or busses.

I think it's more likely to increase when remote work (and maybe virtual reality) increases in popularity. When managers finally realise that you don't need everyone in the same office for a 9-5 shift (and the few advantages of such are replaced by something like VR), then I suspect urban sprawl will continue.

Why care about commuting times if commuting isn't as necessary in the first place?

Self driving cars may make travelling easier, but even then you've got to get somewhere. Even then the inside of a car is a less useful working environment than an office, so short commutes would be preferred.

Re: The end of sprawl

#38

Post by throwaway54665 »

Symbiote wrote: post #29
danking00 wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wonder what type of cities you've lived in. I've lived in various parts of Boston, Cambridge, and Somerville and we've previously had rock band and currently have room scale VR (it is, in fact, in use as I write this). Neither had dedicated rooms but the setup and tear down is manageable. Neighbors never complains about the noise, but we also don't set the bass to room-shaking levels. Perhaps the most significant d…

> By pooling four incomes (two six figure tech salaries and two low five figure academia/architecture) we can afford places with enough living space to be comfortable. I'm surprised people with six-figure salaries are sharing. Is that common?

> I'm surprised people with six-figure salaries are sharing. Is that common?

Six-figure tech salaries.

Did you expect them to move with their non-existent girlfriends?

Re: The end of sprawl

#39

Post by Noos »

angersock wrote: post #18
nine_k wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A long commute in a self-driving car, even more than in a comfortable train, can be a part of your work day, or even your leisure. Commute while driving is manual labor, preventing any meaningful concentration, be it watching a movie or writing code.

It is a sad state of affairs when labor is convinced that spending more of their time in a little box (regardless of pilot) in order to show up to work is somehow any sort of leisure at all. Why is all this tech being used to solve the goal of self-driving cars, and yet remote work is still somehow in the realm of fantasy to most people?

because only a tiny amount of the workforce does the kind of hands-off knowledge work than can be done remotely, and without the need for significant employee control.

Re: The end of sprawl

#40

Post by tomkinstinch »

Symbiote wrote: post #29
danking00 wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wonder what type of cities you've lived in. I've lived in various parts of Boston, Cambridge, and Somerville and we've previously had rock band and currently have room scale VR (it is, in fact, in use as I write this). Neither had dedicated rooms but the setup and tear down is manageable. Neighbors never complains about the noise, but we also don't set the bass to room-shaking levels. Perhaps the most significant d…

> By pooling four incomes (two six figure tech salaries and two low five figure academia/architecture) we can afford places with enough living space to be comfortable. I'm surprised people with six-figure salaries are sharing. Is that common?

In Boston/Cambridge/Somerville it is depressingly common. I wish it were within my means to live alone, but even on six figures it doesn't make sense (I refuse to spend 40-50% of my net income on housing). Having roommates (who aren't romantic partners or family) is the worst. I need sanctuary away from people, and for example, it's frustrating when you want to cook and your cooking equipment is left dirty, when the kitchen is already in use, or when roommates have parties while you're trying to sleep. It's not an issue of having bad roommates, but of having people going about their lives independently in far too close proximity. I used to sleep without earplugs, but since moving to Boston I need to use them every night or I wouldn't ever get a full night of sleep.

Having roommates in one's thirties extends childhood much too far.

For me, density is the enemy, and being near nature is the goal. Unfortunately, jobs are in the city and not in the woods.

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